Copying Recordings

[daddybear]

Good Afternoon All

Please can I have some advice?

I have a HDR-2000T box which is now 6 years old. It is (fingers crossed!! ) working OK at the moment, but in view of it's age I wonder whether I should be considering a newer model soon and hence my questions:-

Can the existing video files be copied to an external HDD via USB and how do I do it? I have a little under half of the internal storage of 500GB used now on the 2000T.

Does an external HDD have to be empty before starting or can the recordings go into a separate folder on the device ? (Not sure I know how to do that anyway ?! ).

If I did all that then got a new model (? FVP-5000T), is it then possible to put the recordings into the new box or can they only then be watched direct from the external device ?

Sorry about so many questions, but I am a novice to these sorts of things - but can usually follow instructions.

Hope someone can help me.

Regards,

Roy.

 

[EEPhil]

You can save standard definition (SD often rewritten on this site as StDef or StdDef to avoid confusion) without any problems to an external USB connected HDD. It is likely to be a slow process. High definition (HD or HiDef) files cannot be moved successfully without using Foxy or something similar. You could have a look at the AutoFoxy thread within the 1800/2000T forum or find the Foxy program within one of the Fox-T2 forums. If you apply the Foxy program to the HiDef programmes these should copy to your USB drive.

To copy to USB. Press media on remote. Find the files you want to copy and press the red button to select them. Press opt+. Select the USB drive. If you press red the files will be placed in the root folder of the drive. If you press OK you can select a folder or create a new one to move the files into.

The external drive must not be formatted using Fat32 [Edit: not Fat-12] otherwise you won’t be able to save large files. I use NTFS drives. If you have a suitable drive that isn’t blank but is correctly formatted and has enough space, you can use it.

If you get a 5000T it is possible to play the saved files directly from the USB drive. They will not be indexed in the same way as on the 2000T and you will not be able to save the position you are at if you stop the playback. Information from the EPG will not appear on the 5000T’s screen. You can upload the files to an area on the 5000T’s disk, but they will be playable with the same restrictions as for an external disk.

 

[prpr]

The external drive must not be formatted using Fat-12 otherwise you won’t be able to save large files.

You don't get much video in 32MB do you?

 

[Black Hole]

Fat-12

You mean FAT32 (the other varieties of FAT are unlikely to be in use these days). The file size limit for FAT32 is 4GB, which would be a very long recording if it were StDef, so that's probably OK (but see below).

Please can I have some advice?

The reason for the caveats is that these PVRs encrypt the recordings. They can play the recordings regardless of the encryption, but enforce copyright by only allowing StDef recordings to be copied to a USB drive (StDef recordings are decrypted in the process of copying, HiDef recordings can be copied but remain encrypted). The encryption is unique to each individual unit: PVR B cannot decrypt a recording made by PVR A, even if they are both HDR-2000Ts.

We don't know how to defeat the encryption, but the process known as foxy kids the unit into believing a HiDef recording is actually a StDef recording. The software recently made available HERE streamlines the process (but I haven't tested it personally). Basically, the user uses the provided Windows program to poke into the HDR-1800T or HDR-2000T by FTP (ie across your home network), and (according to that thread) a report is provided on which recordings are protected HiDef with the option of unprotecting them. Looks good. Having been unprotected, the recording will be decrypted on copy to USB.

This is only of interest to you if the recordings you want to save are HiDef, in which case FAT32 might not be sufficient and you would be better advised to use NTFS on the external drive / stick.

I believe it might also be possible to copy StDef and unprotected recordings across your home network directly to your PC, using DLNA accesses. More details on request.

 

[bottletop]

...
This is only of interest to you if the recordings you want to save are HiDef, in which case FAT32 might not be sufficient and you would be better advised to use NTFS on the external drive / stick.
..

You may find the HDR-2000T will allow read and access to external USB drives with EXT3 partitions - so that may be a better bet.
I think it only allows read access to NTFS partitions. (It also allows read and write access to FAT partitions.)

 

[daddybear]

Thanks to all for such prompt replies - very kind.

Just a couple of queries to clarify please, if I may.

-I only do StDef recordings.

-"It is likely to be a slow process" - Any ideas as to how slow ? Is the size of the recording to be copied (in GBs) the same going onto the external HDD ? eg. 250GBs from 200T needs 250 GB space on the ext HDD ?

-"you will not be able to save the position you are at if you stop the playback." - does that include say just pausing a film to go and put the kettle on?

-" You can upload the files to an area on the 5000T’s disk," - how do I do that, please ?

I think I have got the necessary external drives now, but if not I will get some.

Sorry to be a dummy, but I think I have nearly got it all straight in my mind now.

Regards,

Roy.

 

[MartinLiddle]

I think it only allows read access to NTFS partitions. (It also allows read and write access to FAT partitions.)

My recollection is that the HDR-2000T provides read/write access to NTFS.

 

[EEPhil]

You mean FAT32

My fingers are too big for this iPhone keyboard! Of course I mean Fat32.

 

[EEPhil]

I think it only allows read access to NTFS partitions. (It also allows read and write access to FAT partitions.)

It does read/write on my 2000T.

My recollection is that the HDR-2000T provides read/write access to NTFS.

Your recollection is correct.

 

[MartinLiddle]

-I only do StDef recordings.

-"It is likely to be a slow process" - Any ideas as to how slow ? Is the size of the recording to be copied (in GBs) the same going onto the external HDD ? eg. 250GBs from 200T needs 250 GB space on the ext HDD ?

Fairly slow. The fastest way is via the DLNA server using either the program that Black Hole referred to or the in built capability in Windows 10 (if you have a Windows 10 computer).

-"you will not be able to save the position you are at if you stop the playback." - does that include say just pausing a film to go and put the kettle on?

You will be able to pause successfully.

-" You can upload the files to an area on the 5000T’s disk," - how do I do that, please ?

In the Humax settings you need to turn on FTP and the Download folder (Settings>Advanced settings>File Share) and then use an FTP client such as Filezilla to do the transfer to the Humax.

 

[Black Hole]

I only do StDef recordings

That helps: no foxy trickery required, and no real restrictions on the format of the USB drive. Portable HDDs generally come pre-formatted NTFS, whereas UPDs (USB Pen Drives) are typically FAT32.

Any ideas as to how slow ?

From experience of HDR-FOX: about 12GB/hour. You might find large transfers unreliable, in which case select only a few folders or recordings for copy each time (using the menu system).

Is the size of the recording to be copied (in GBs) the same going onto the external HDD ? eg. 250GBs from 200T needs 250 GB space on the ext HDD ?

Yes, of course.

"you will not be able to save the position you are at if you stop the playback." - does that include say just pausing a film to go and put the kettle on?

This means the additional information which is attached to a (say) HDR-2000T recording is not necessarily compatible with a different model. It isn't a deal-breaker. To ensure a recording is reasonably transportable, simply delete everything except the .TS file (then the destination machine will build its own version of additional information).

A lot of what you are asking will become apparent when you actually try to do it.

Of course I mean Fat32.

Sure, but it had to be pointed out for readers who might not realise. FAT12 did exist.

 

[EEPhil]

Any ideas as to how slow ?

Difficult. I don’t use this method, or the 2000T much now. I have had problems with a short radio recording taking hours to transfer. This was using a thumb drive so might not be a good comparison. I seem to think trial and error discovered that the rear USB port saves faster than the front one - or maybe I’m confusing that with the 5000T. I would need to do a test.

does that include say just pausing a film to go and put the kettle on?

Yes you can pause an external recording. If you stop it the position is lost. Recordings made on a 5000T can be stopped and you can come back to it later.

how do I do that, please ?

I need to have a think before I answer that. Perhaps someone else can beat me to it!

 

[EEPhil]

In the Humax settings you need to turn on FTP and the Download folder (Settings>Advanced settings>File Share) and then use an FTP client such as Filezilla to do the transfer to the Humax.

That’s probably the best way. I was thinking of using the Humax to upload from the USB drive - but I need to double check that works as I think it does!

 

[EEPhil]

Speed: A not very scientific result. I transferred a file from a 2000T to a 500GB portable drive (powered from the USB cable). It took 14.25 minutes to transfer 1 559 371 776 bytes (1.45 GiB). That makes it about 104.36 MiB/minute. Not very fast!

Alternative way to transfer files onto a 5000T: Plug the USB drive into the 5000T. You will be presented with an on-screen graphic asking you for Video, Music, or Photos. You can get to this at any time by pressing [F] on the remote. Navigate to Media. From the Video/Music/Photos select Video. If your USB device is plugged in you will see something like Detachable HDD in the left hand of the screen. Select this and navigate to the file you want to move. Press +, select Move or Copy and then Internal HDD.
When you want to play that file [F]/Media/Video/Internal HDD/ and navigate to file.

The benefit of using the method Martin suggested is that the file transfers are quicker. It is possible within the download area to create folders (using your ftp client) and put files together in a logical fashion.

 

[daddybear]

Speed: A not very scientific result. I transferred a file from a 2000T to a 500GB portable drive (powered from the USB cable). It took 14.25 minutes to transfer 1 559 371 776 bytes (1.45 GiB). That makes it about 104.36 MiB/minute. Not very fast!

Alternative way to transfer files onto a 5000T: Plug the USB drive into the 5000T. You will be presented with an on-screen graphic asking you for Video, Music, or Photos. You can get to this at any time by pressing [F] on the remote. Navigate to Media. From the Video/Music/Photos select Video. If your USB device is plugged in you will see something like Detachable HDD in the left hand of the screen. Select this and navigate to the file you want to move. Press +, select Move or Copy and then Internal HDD.
When you want to play that file [F]/Media/Video/Internal HDD/ and navigate to file.

The benefit of using the method Martin suggested is that the file transfers are quicker. It is possible within the download area to create folders (using your ftp client) and put files together in a logical fashion.

Thanks for that EEPhil

Speed- What size do you think a 1hour 45min. film is in terms of GBs ?

I don't think I am too bothered about fast speeds as I can't really envisage doing a lot of transfers - it is only wanting to save existing recordings if I change the machine.
I did have a look at the Filezilla website but sadly way above my head!! Do you all have your boxes connected to the internet all the time? Mine isn't and never has been.

The alternative way of transfer you have suggested seems to be much more within my capabilities and something I could have a go at - time is not really a factor, as I mentioned. Otherwise I think I would just store the recordings I wanted on the external drive and watch them from there as and when required.

One other point about the posting here - I didn't deliberately copy the big yellow box with all your previous reply, but somehow it got inserted into the top of my reply. Do you know why? Can I stop it happening again?

As you can see I am not too good at all this but I do really appreciate you all helping me. If I need to come back again it will be tomorrow now.

Regards,

Roy.

 

[Black Hole]

Do you all have your boxes connected to the internet all the time?

Those of us with HDR-FOXes and using the custom firmware, yes. Also those wanting to share recordings around the house by DLNA (which doesn't need the Internet as such, but does require connection to the home network).

it is only wanting to save existing recordings if I change the machine.

You also want to save important existing recordings in case the HDD or the whole machine fails.

What size do you think a 1hour 45min. film is in terms of GBs ?

It very much depends on which channel it was on. Some have a higher bit rate (and therefore quality) than others. A quick skim in my library says (eg) a 122-minute movie on Film4 (StDef) comes in at 1.9GB. On the other hand, 101 minutes HiDef on BBC TWO comes in at 5.2GB.

But you already know you want to shift 250GB, so that's 20 hours on a HDR-FOX – I don't understand why a 2000T should be double that according to EEPhil's test.

One other point about the posting here - I didn't deliberately copy the big yellow box with all your previous reply, but somehow it got inserted into the top of my reply. Do you know why? Can I stop it happening again?

It is useful to provide context of what exactly you are replying to, and there are various forum tools for doing just that. The "reply" button, for example quotes the whole post. For details see Newbies' Guide to the Forum (click).

 

[EEPhil]

But you already know you want to shift 250GB, so that's 20 hours on a HDR-FOX – I don't understand why a 2000T should be double that according to EEPhil's test.

Neither do I. I may be doing something wrong. But I don’t think so. I’m sure I’ve seen other people moaning about transfer speeds on both the 2000T and 5000T on this and another well-known Humax site. Reading from a USB drive seems to be a lot faster. Of course the Humax shouldn’t be decrypting in this case (but can be). The slowness of writing to a USB drive is why I prefer using the DLNA server and stream the files off. That seems quicker to me. Having said that, my configuration is on a go slow at present. I may have cocked-up some connections when I moved.

 

[EEPhil]

Do you all have your boxes connected to the internet all the time? Mine isn't and never has been.

I don’t. I do have a network switch linking a 2000T, 5000T and my laptop. The laptop is only connected to the internet when I want to use it. Even then it’s through my iPhone. I rarely use the ability to watch on demand, although I can if I really want to.

 

[daddybear]

It very much depends on which channel it was on. Some have a higher bit rate (and therefore quality) than others. A quick skim in my library says (eg) a 122-minute movie on Film4 (StDef) comes in at 1.9GB. On the other hand, 101 minutes HiDef on BBC TWO comes in at 5.2GB.

Thanks, Black Hole, for clearing up the "reply" problem - result as above !!

How do I find out the size in GB of each recording on my box? Is my library under "media" ?

How will I know when a recording for just one item (eg: one film) has finished - or batches of a few, as per your advice in post # 11.

Thanks also to EEPhil for the further info.

Regards,

Roy.

 

[Black Hole]

How do I find out the size in GB of each recording on my box?

You would have to FTP in (eg using Filezilla - which effectively provides a file manager view for devices across a network). Beware that using FTP to copy across the network will not decrypt the recordings.

Alternatively you could add up how many minutes of recordings make up the 250GB total to get an average MB/minute, then assume any particular recording will me more-or-less how many minutes it is multiplied by the average MB/min. Or copy one to USB and take a look at the result.

Is my library under "media" ?

The media button? Yes. Don't you have a manual?

How will I know when a recording for just one item (eg: one film) has finished - or batches of a few, as per your advice in post # 11.

What did I tell you about "just trying it"? Dunno about the 2000T, but on the HDR-FOX it says something like "copying" when you open the media menu.