Play back of copied Videos

humaxmuddlehead

New Member
Hi..new to this but need help ..will try and make the problem clear!
I am a dab hand a copying stuff from my Foxsat HDR . to USB ...so far so good. I have now bought a new HUMAX sat box that does not have copy facility .
My plan is to take the old Foxsat HDR to our holiday home and use it to play back recorded stuff on TV ( this works I have checked!)
I borrowed a HDR 1800T and recorded and copied stuff...but although it plays back from USB stick on the same machine when I try it, but on the Foxsat HDR, although the title of programme is there there is no content .
Playing stuff back that has been recorded on neighbors Foxsat works
So experts help is needed, is there a way round this ....AND if I was to buy a second hand Humax HDR FoxT2 to record and copy stuff from would that be compatible with play back on Fox sat HDR
 

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Playback of HDR-FOX (DVB-T/T2) recorded material is not seamless on FOXSAT (DVB-S/S2), but can be done with a little manipulation. So much easier to acquire two HDR-FOXes, or one and a HD-FOX (for playback), and then all that needs to be done is to defeat the encryption (easy).

However, if you are happy to play content without bells and whistles such as media titles, bookmarks, and skip, the HDR-FOX recordings can be decrypted and converted to .mpg (automatically, if you like), which just about any kind of media player (including FOXSAT) will cope with (so long as it has the right codecs).
 
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humaxmuddlehead

New Member
Thanks...but you are sort of talking greek! seems odd that copied content cant be played else where ....i seem to remember USB content played on lap top
 

MikeSh

Well-Known Member
seems odd that copied content cant be played else where ....i seem to remember USB content played on lap top
This is down to the last bit of BH's post: (so long as it has the right codecs).
(Codecs are a sort of dictionary to translate the content to something the device can display)

Laptops are generally well loaded and can usually grab stuff from the internet as well if needed. PVRs are much less capable, so you often need to process the content into a form that the box has codecs for already as you can't usually add new ones.
 

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
seems odd that copied content cant be played else where ....i seem to remember USB content played on lap top
But that was almost certainly not HiDef recordings.

There are two things to contend with: encryption, and compatibility.

Regarding encryption, the content providers do not want free copies of HiDef broadcasts competing with Blu-Ray etc - so they insist manufacturers of digital PVRs with HiDef capability secure the recordings. In the case of FOXSAT, that means you can copy off StDef recordings but HiDef recordings are encrypted. The situation is different with HDR-FOX (and HDR-1800T), see Things Every... (click) section 5.

Re compatibility: digital broadcasting requires the video and audio data streams to be heavily compressed, otherwise there would be too much data. You might know of this in terms of audio - MP3 files are much smaller than the equivalent original data such as a WAV file or the uncompressed data on a CD... but MP3 is only one way to compress audio, and if the audio was compressed with OGG (for example) the player would have to be able to decompress OGG. (Compression is the process of eliminating redundant or almost redundant information from a data stream in such a way that, when decompressed, the results are practically indistinguishable from the original to human perception. The compression/decompression algorithm is embodied in software known as a "coder-decoder"... or "codec" for short.)

There are similarly many methods to compress video, and the broadcast stream contains both audio and video, each with its own compression, interleaved by what's known as a "container format" - thus three factors that need player compatibility. The formats used for digital satellite broadcasting (DVB-S and DVB-S2) are not identical with the formats used for terrestrial broadcasting (DVB-T and DVB-T2), so recordings made with a satellite receiver are not directly compatible with a terrestrial player (and vice versa)... even if encryption is not an issue. That's why I recommended using a terrestrial unit (HD-FOX) to play back terrestrial recordings (made on an HDR-FOX and decrypted).

As MikeSh says the player needs the right codecs (ie the software modules which decompress the video and audio streams), and to be able to understand the container format. Something like VLC running on a PC will be able to play practically anything; a TV media player or other self-contained player (including HDR-FOX and FOXSAT) probably can't.

We use custom firmware to eliminate encryption on our HDR-FOXes, and there is a patch to FOXSAT which prevents it encrypting recordings in the first place (existing FOXSAT HiDef recordings cannot be decrypted). We can also use custom firmware on our HDR-FOXes to convert the broadcast M2TS container format (.ts files) to MPG (more easily understood by other players). Changing the codecs within the container requires too much processing power for HDR-FOX, but can be done on a PC.

Thanks...but you are sort of talking greek!
I try not to, but talking technical requires an understanding of basic terms. See Glossary (click).
 
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humaxmuddlehead

New Member
Thanks all...but feel this is far too technical for me ...I only record in SD. The only way forward is to get friend with the same model Fox Sat to record for me and copy onto a USB stick ...then I can take the usb to holiday home and play back on my old FoxSat machine.
But just to clarify.... content copied form a FOXT2 will not play on a FOX sat ..correct???
And thanks
 

MartinLiddle

Super Moderator
Staff member
But just to clarify.... content copied form a FOXT2 will not play on a FOX sat ..correct???
The Foxsat-hdr can't play video files via the usb port without the required sidecar files. Three files are required xxxx.ts, xxxx.nts and xxxx.htm.
Raydons AV2HDR will create all three files for you; somebody will hopefully pop up and say where it can be found as the two links I have found don't work.
 

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Thanks all...but feel this is far too technical for me
You give up very easily. Success does not come without persistence, but there's no reason you can't succeed.

You want to take recordings on holiday (presumably abroad) and play them. You have a redundant FOXSAT-HDR you hope to use as a media player but you have discovered your new satellite PVR (HDR-1100S?) won't export to USB. Suppose you switch them around - will the HDR-1100S (or whatever) play recordings exported from the FOXSAT-HDR?

There are lots of ways to skin this particular cat. In particular, you don't need to use your FOXSAT-HDR as a media player - there are very cheap mini computer systems that can run media players far more capable than a FOXSAT, with HDMI output... eg Raspberry Pi.
 

Ezra Pound

Well-Known Member
Raydons AV2HDR will create all three files for you; somebody will hopefully pop up and say where it can be found as the two links I have found don't work.
I have updated the link in the Wiki for AV2HDR-T2 (See Link HERE)

Note :- This package Creates the Output files *.TS *.NTS *.HMT that Martin refers to in post #7, however (as detailed in post #10), there may be some mixup between AV2HDR-T2 and AV2HDR packages
 
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humaxmuddlehead

New Member
Thanks Ezra ..and I have this downloaded onto PC But yiu are going to think I am a completely useless ..I have looked at the help file but no info at all there . What am I meant to do with this, presumably this is put onto foxsat via USB
 
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humaxmuddlehead

New Member
You give up very easily. Success does not come without persistence, but there's no reason you can't succeed.

You want to take recordings on holiday (presumably abroad) and play them. You have a redundant FOXSAT-HDR you hope to use as a media player but you have discovered your new satellite PVR (HDR-1100S?) won't export to USB. Suppose you switch them around - will the HDR-1100S (or whatever) play recordings exported from the FOXSAT-HDR?

There are lots of ways to skin this particular cat. In particular, you don't need to use your FOXSAT-HDR as a media player - there are very cheap mini computer systems that can run media players far more capable than a FOXSAT, with HDMI output... eg Raspberry Pi.
Yes, that sounds just what i want to do ...but more than happy with my new Humax, despite the fact that it has no copy facility. I plan to take the old and now redundant at home FOXsat to holiday home . What i was hoping to do was copy stuff from a friends HDR 1800T which I have borrowed and got set up, it records, copies to USB stick but will not play on the FOXSAT ...and so I am presuming this will be the same problem with all models except the same as mine . I had in mind to buy second hand at HDRFOXT2 and record stuff over time so that I could then copy onto usb and pay on the FOXsat in its new home ..where it will stay ....I am very persistent but not winning with this!!!
 

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
You said all that in the first place.

What I've told you is that to play back on FOXSAT you need either FOXSAT originated files, or if you must record from terrestrial rather than satellite you will have to use a conversion process to make the recordings suitable for FOXSAT. I take it you understand the difference between satellite and terrestrial (HDR-FOX and 1800T are terrestrial).

What I have suggested, to save you loads of grief, is that if you intend to record terrestrial, you also use a terrestrial unit for playback (or a proper media player which doesn't care).
 
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