Email Disaster

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
To add to my woes, BT are restructuring their email provision - details here:

http://www.lovemoney.com/news/cars-...t-ends-free-email-for-non-broadband-customers

This has been on the radar for a few weeks, but by way of emails that look very much like emails that have been crying wolf previously and appeared to be phishing attempts (and they could still be phishing attempts on the back of an actual event). Web searches turned up as many opinions that it was real as opinions that is was fake, so I reserved judgement. The lovemoney.com item looks well researched, so I am inclined to believe it.

I have used talk21.com as my main email for as long as I have been using web mail, before that I had Pegasus running on my PC but I can't remember which address I used. I have a significant archive of communications (which, on the scale of the Universe, probably doesn't matter much - but I am a hoarder!). I have Gmail addresses but I don't find Gmail works as well (or to my liking) as Yahoo. If I want to stick with Yahoo I have to change my email address (and advise my contacts, some of which will lose the advice note) and maybe lose my archive.

I could pay the £20 per year and keep my main address (but lose any other talk21.com addresses I have for auxiliary purposes), it's not so much, but what is the new BT interface going to be like? Will they then continue to bugger about in the future, maybe hold account holders to ransom?

I own a domain name through 1&1, I guess I could subscribe to their web mail service and have an email address under my own control - anybody know how good their interface is? Does it play nicely with iOS? I will still have transfer or lose my archive, and there are paid-for storage space considerations. How would I pull the archive (complete) to my own off-line storage (and keep it accessible)?

Suggestions welcome.
 

Mike0001

Well-Known Member
I have Gmail addresses but I don't find Gmail works as well (or to my liking) as Yahoo.

So what is wrong with gmail? I hardly ever use my BT email, and anything sent there gets forwarded to gmail. Gmail has also used IMAP for ages, rather than POP.

I generally use the web interface now as I haven't met a standalone program that correctly handles gmail labels.
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Apart from "personal" accounts I also (mainly) use Gmail for administration of a club. Although I have not tried accessing Gmail via the native iPad email app, web browser access via iOS (even Mercury) is clunky and does not support address groups. I suspect the app wouldn't support groups either, and that there are other features available from a full PC browser that don't work on iPad. Yahoo has it's problems too, but not (in my experience) so many.
 

Mike0001

Well-Known Member
Apart from "personal" accounts I also (mainly) use Gmail for administration of a club. Although I have not tried accessing Gmail via the native iPad email app, web browser access via iOS (even Mercury) is clunky and does not support address groups. I suspect the app wouldn't support groups either, and that there are other features available from a full PC browser that don't work on iPad. Yahoo has it's problems too, but not (in my experience) so many.

Ah, message groups and access from mobile devices, I see. Gmail's support for groups seems strange, in that you don't see a group identifier in the "To:" field (#GroupName or whatever), but all the group members get listed instead.

I did manage to get the same interface on my Nexus 7 as on my PC, by choosing the Desktop option in Chrome, then Standard HTML. That allowed me to type a group name in the To: field.
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Spam filtering is another thing - wherever I go needs to have a good adaptive spam filter in place (which is not so aggressive as to siphon off real messages). Yahoo performs well, and I think Gmail does too.
 

MikeSh

Well-Known Member
I've been with 1&1 for over 10 years now and use a number of domains and e-mail addresses within that account. I now use IMAP across several devices but only PCs and Android, not any Apple stuff, so can't say what an iOS would be like.

The main problem I get is not being able to sync address books across devices, mainly because Thunderbird on the PCs has a completely bizarre system for them.

I hardly ever use the 1&1 webmail interface, but it has been revamped recently. It seems to have a plethora of settings for appearance, layout, etc.

As regards archives I have successfully moved stuff from one e-mail account to another via Thunderbird, which then pushes them back down the IMAP pipe to the 1&1 servers. I can't remember in detail how I did it now, but one way I think the stuff just got deleted as it wasn't on the server, and I had to do things a certain way to make it work. So it is possible - just not obvious.

I do use the 1&1 spam filters on some accounts, but I don't know how good it really is. I'd say it's a bit aggressive if anything - I have quite a long whitelist. We also have the junk filter on Thunderbird, so maybe that catches a bit that 1&1 has missed.
 

dandnsmith

Forum Supporter
I, too, have used 1&1 for a number of years - having a domain registered through them, and just an email-redirection service. The email recipients for the domain are people associated with a small charity - so each of them provides an email address (mostly gmail) to which to redirect their emails.
I've found them helpful, in the main, but had s minor problem recently as a result of the re-presentation of the administration features for clients - easily sorted after a couple of phone calls.
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
So what you are saying is I could actually use any web mail service I like (and move around if I want), while keeping a static email address at my own domain which passes the email on? When it comes to replying (or even originating, for that matter), how do you make it appear that the email is coming from the owned domain?
 

Mike0001

Well-Known Member
So what you are saying is I could actually use any web mail service I like (and move around if I want), while keeping a static email address at my own domain which passes the email on? When it comes to replying (or even originating, for that matter), how do you make it appear that the email is coming from the owned domain?


You mean, just set the "Reply To:" field?
 

Trev

The Dumb One
What is spam about asking someone to 'reply to' an email address that is different from which the original was sent. That's what the 'reply to' parameter is for?
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
The point is that if one has a forwarding email service, one doesn't want to send out emails that appear to be coming from somewhere else. Apart from peeking some curiosity, it could be tricky when it comes to white lists. I have also come across examples of where "reply to" doesn't work.
 

Mike0001

Well-Known Member
What is spam about asking someone to 'reply to' an email address that is different from which the original was sent. That's what the 'reply to' parameter is for?

I agree. However, any way of changing the "From" field to something other than what it should be would allow spammers to freely do that. It is supposed to be harder to do that, to prevent email hoaxing and hiding the originator's email, surely?

I suggested the "Reply To" solution, but I understood BH to say that he wanted to change the "From" header. If he could easily do that, then anyone could easily spam others and also send emails pretending to come from others. Surely? I know people can do that, but it is intentionally made difficult.

I assume BH wants to send from email address xxx@yyy.zzz without actually disclosing that address?
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
The issue is to have an email address I will change to once and never have to change again. The suggestion I was responding to was that I set up an email address at a URL I own (post 8) and forward email to a web mail service that I could then change as and when required without affecting my email address.

The problem with this approach (as I see it) is that one cannot do so without revealing that one's email is coming from somewhere other than the address one is publicising as one's point of contact, and human nature is such that the wrong address will get used and incorporated into address books. Hence the issue is not resolved. I am not trying to circumvent normal security, merely enquiring and pointing out the difficulty with post 8.

The question is: how do other people solve this?
 

af123

Administrator
Staff member
Just migrate once and for all to a domain of your own, then point the Mail eXchanger (MX) records in DNS to a mail hosting service of your choice and have all your email delivered there. Access the mail host via IMAP or Webmail or a combination and migrate to a new mail provider if and when required without changing your email address. I'd recommend Fastmail - they can even pull mail down from your old host to do a one-off initial synchronisation.

Other providers are available, some of which are more flexible and could even download email from your old provider on an ongoing basis and flag mail that came in that way, allowing you to update people on a continual basis until you're completely away from the old email address.
 

Mike0001

Well-Known Member
Just migrate once and for all to a domain of your own, then point the Mail eXchanger (MX) records in DNS to a mail hosting service of your choice and have all your email delivered there. Access the mail host via IMAP or Webmail or a combination and migrate to a new mail provider if and when required without changing your email address. I'd recommend Fastmail - they can even pull mail down from your old host to do a one-off initial synchronisation.

Other providers are available, some of which are more flexible and could even download email from your old provider on an ongoing basis and flag mail that came in that way, allowing you to update people on a continual basis until you're completely away from the old email address.

This is what I used to do, until I discovered how much renewing a domain cost. I couldn't justify the expense for personal use, scrooge that I am.
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
It depends what domain you go for and who you rent it from.

I am still confused, but I have gathered a quantity of information (thanks all) to digest over the next week.
 

MikeSh

Well-Known Member
I went to 1&1 to avoid all the hassle of webmail (Hotmail, etc) or mail provided by my ISP which was largely out of my control, and/or would change address with ISP, and may have privacy issues. I have my domains/addresses and just use them via the IMAP. I don't need webmail (except I have a gmail account to service my Android devices - I don't use it for general e-mail at all) but can access my e-mail via 'webmail' if I'm not on one of my own computing devices.
(Actually, that last bit is only 'in principle'. I could never remember the passwords that are set :eek: )

These days I pay 1&1 an annual fee (~£36/yr) for the Beginner package. This gives me plenty of webspace for hosting my various hobby albums and more e-mail accounts than I could ever want. On top I have 4 or 5 domains (.me.uk and .co.uk) which cost about £3.50 a year each. The charges for these and the basic package are taken by DD and 1&1 auto-renew the domains (unless I kill them off) so I don't lose them .... hopefully.
Expensive? Well I fork out probably £200+ a year on printer ink as my wife prints her photos at A4. Then there's the broadband, the cost/depreciation of the hardware, electricity, etc, .....
 
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