FVP-5000T

Luke said:
This thread (Post #2) suggests it has been tried with USB:
https://myhumax.org/forum/topic/recordings-backup-box-swap#post-45240

Is that along the same lines of extracting HD recordings unencrypted from the HDR-FOX T2/2000T/1800T without custom firmware and without being networked, by extracting all files for a recording, amending just one of the sidecar files, copying them all back and then recopying them all out again?
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I'm non-the-wiser as to whether it is possible from reading that post, unless it is hidden in Barry's reply.

I was thinking of something similar, but a little more devious. I'm not in a position to try it. But let me give everyone an overview of my thinking. As I pointed out earlier, it will be incredibly tedious - if it works - and probably can't be automated.

In each case, the USB probably needs to be removed from the Humax before deleting Humax files.
  1. Is it possible to save StdDef programmes to USB, delete original from Humax, and then restore from USB to Humax? Is it playable in exactly the same way as it was when you first recorded it?
  2. Is it possible to ftp from the Humax all the files relating to a StdDef programme to a PC and then to the "correct" folder in a USB drive (currently attached to PC) , then delete Humax files and restore from USB (now connected to Humax)? Has the .ts file been decrypted? (ie. If you ftp it to PC can you play it?)
  3. If 1) and 2) are possible, can the Humax be fooled by ftping to PC all the files relating to a StdDef programme (except the .ts maybe) plus the .ts of a HiDef file that you want. Rename the HiDef .ts file with the StdDef .ts name and place on the USB drive in the "correct" folder. Remove all traces of the StdDef programme from the Humax. Plug USB into Humax and restore the "mixed" programme to the Humax. If this works at all, it probably won't play on the Humax. But does the .ts file get decrypted and if you ftp it back to the PC is it playable? If this doesn't work on first attempt, try a StdDef programme from one of the HiDef multiplexes (eg. 5USA+1)
I have used the rename a file method on a 2000T. But you can actually do that over the ftp interface and don't need to copy the files about all over the place. I have a small file (T20 cricket on 5LSX, about 1 minute long) that I use as a proxy when I want to stream a HiDef file to my PC and I can't be bothered to "Foxy" the HiDef file, go to the Humax, force it to reindex the DLNA database, go back to the PC and stream it. It works, but screws up the Humax files if the damned thing crashes part way through. (At least I can manually correct the files through the ftp connection).
 
Pretty sure your idea fails at step 2. The decryption key is held somewhere in the box and not in the recording files themselves. Once off the box copying the files does just that ie Produces an exact digital copy,

On the HDR-FOX-T2, HDR-1800T and HDR-2000T the box looks at a single byte in the accompanying .hmt file. Just changing this in a HD recording causes the box to decrypt on copying to USB. On a FVP-5000T copying using samba or usb decrypts a SD recording, directly copying using FTP directly copies the content leaving SD encrypted. Only the box itself is capable of decrypting the content, the trick is to enable decryption for all recordings. This would also presumably enable the FVP-5000T media server to decrypt on streaming for HD as well SD content.

The .hmt file from the earlier boxes can be opened using a binary file reader and much of the content is recognisable as ascii strings containing all sorts of information like for instance the programme synopses. If you try the same with the 2 similar files from a 5000T it's just a meaningless series of bytes which suggest these files are themselves encrypted.

There is no way to re-name a recording file built into the FVP-5000T.
 
Attached is the files created by recording the same programme from BBC1-SD and BBC1-HD. The file names are the same, the suffixes are added by Filezilla. Not even sure which of the sidecars goes with the HD recording and which goes with the SD recording. Only the sizes of the .ts indicates which is which.


HDandSDrecordings.jpg
 
Either I have not explained myself very well, or you don't understand what I'm getting at. Either way, the result is the same.

On other Humaxes copying a StdDef programme to or from a USB drive (using the commands on the Humax remote) has the pleasant side effect of decrypting it (and changing some bytes in the .hmt file). With the command issued from the Humax, the decryption key should be available. The point of 2) is test whether building an encrypted set of files on the USB with the hope that using the Humax to copy it back to its own disk (if this is possible) will decrypt it. If Humax have clamped down on this possibility then I can't see any way of proceeding (although a further iteration of saving to USB might decrypt it???). I'm well aware that ftping the files creates an exact copy of the encrypted file, but that is what this method would rely on - if it works.

I did not say rename the recording on the Humax. I said, can you take a set of encrypted files from the Humax (one of the sidecar files may have a byte set in it, but we can't see into it or change it, but the Humax can) place them in the "correct" folder of the USB drive, dump the .ts file and replace it with an encrypted HiDef file which you rename - on your PC - and place on the USB? You would then use the Humax to copy the files back to itself in the hope that the .ts gets decrypted. If it does get decrypted you could ftp it off the Humax or you might be able to stream it.
 
I wasn't clear from the reference that Luke posted. I got the impression that Barry on the other site hinted that it was...
giverny on myhumax.org said:
What is the best thing to keep the SD recordings that are OK. Can I just copy the files from the humax recordings folder to my NAS box (5GB done only 110GB / 15 hours more to go) and then copy them back to the recordings folder on the replacement box or is life more complicated than that ?
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Barry on myhumax.org said:
I would not bother copying them back (not sure it is actually possible via network, it is if you save to usb HDD) just play from the NAS via Media Centre.
Click to expand...
Not clear, is it?
Anybody know for sure?
 
You can copy an unecrypted recording .ts to a totally seperate partition (Video) designed to replay external content. I haven't a clue what post 26 means, the sidecar files contain much more than just the do not decrypt flag, they have to match the recording file in so many ways.



Copying the recording does not change the .hmt flag, it's the complete opposite, Changing the flag pre-copying tells the box to decrypt on copying. That's why you can use the built in 1800/2000T ftp capability to exploit the same loophole found on the original HDR-FOX-T2 but not the decrypt in situ that requires the CF to enable.

If you copy all the files as is from any of the Freeview+ boxes there is no way to decrypt the content externally from the box. 5000T Files decrypted by virtue of the available options (Samba/USB) can be used on anything.

Only the box that recorded it has the capability to decrypt it. The built in copying routines are the only way to access the key.

If you import external content to the video partition even though it was encrypted by the box it will not be usable.

On earlier boxes you could export a recording to USB and play it back from USB (extending the recording storage) provided the original sideacar files are present.

Raydon even created a way of building sideacar files from non native content that allowed the full capability of the original recordings (like skip forward, backwards etc).


So far not found any way to do this with a 5000T. Connecting a USB drive with the full set of files is not recognised by the media player option. If you present a USB drive with the decrypted .ts file it plays like any other, and can be copied to the Video partition (not the recording partition).

Once you have a set of files on a PC, the PC knows what default apps are set to play back known extensions (like .ts - transport stream) .

It has no idea about .nts .hmt. It merely copies all files as is there is no way it will decrypt content, it's just copying bytes.
 
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I'm on the verge of giving up! All the items in the last post I knew already.
I've tried to explain an idea but you clearly don't understand what I'm saying. That is clear from your reply when you talk about decrypted .ts on the USB, and by sidecar files and by decrypting externally.

In an earlier post (#14) you showed the structure of the USB drive.
What is not clear at this point is, that if you have the USB drive disconnected from your Humax, and make sure "The Farmer's Llamas" no longer exists on your Humax, when you plug the USB back into the Humax, is there a way of copying, using a copy command on the Humax* (not Samba or ftp or anything else) of returning the programme to the HDD on the Humax in the .recordings directory? If so does the Humax now treat this programme as it did before you saved it ie. as a native recording (you may need to remove the USB from the Humax to test this)? If this is not possible, then there is no hope.
(* You must have used a copy command on the Humax to place "The Farmer's Llamas" on the USB. Can the same command copy from the USB back to the Humax [and hopefully into the HDD .recordings folder] as may have been hinted at by Barry's reply on myhumax.org?)
 
EEPhil said:
I'm on the verge of giving up! All the items in the last post I knew already.
I've tried to explain an idea but you clearly don't understand what I'm saying. That is clear from your reply when you talk about decrypted .ts on the USB, and by sidecar files and by decrypting externally.

In an earlier post (#14) you showed the structure of the USB drive.
What is not clear at this point is, that if you have the USB drive disconnected from your Humax, and make sure "The Farmer's Llamas" no longer exists on your Humax, when you plug the USB back into the Humax, is there a way of copying, using a copy command on the Humax* (not Samba or ftp or anything else) of returning the programme to the HDD on the Humax in the .recordings directory? If so does the Humax now treat this programme as it did before you saved it ie. as a native recording (you may need to remove the USB from the Humax to test this)? If this is not possible, then there is no hope.
(* You must have used a copy command on the Humax to place "The Farmer's Llamas" on the USB. Can the same command copy from the USB back to the Humax [and hopefully into the HDD .recordings folder] as may have been hinted at by Barry's reply on myhumax.org?)
Click to expand...

As I already posted, the only option to import video files from a connected usb device, is copy compatible video file(s) to a folder labelled video which is reserved for user content. You can't access the recordings folder from USB to upload files only download them.

The copy move and other commands are invoked from the recordings list by using the + key. there is no way to access files stored on a usb device from the recordings list so it's a one way option.

Only way to access the recordings folder directly is by FTP. I guess you could move a HD recording to usb and then replace it using FTP, but it wouldn't achieve anything except perhaps save disk space. As my 5000T has a 2TB drive I doubt this will be useful anytime soon.

This arrangement is identical to the G2 Freesat+ boxes except that you can't export recordings at all, only content you have uploaded to the user folders for video, music or photos.

Guessing only way is to determine the format of the support files and modify the HD ones and replace using ftp.
 
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grahamlthompson said:
The file names are the same, the suffixes are added by Filezilla.
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The suffix is part of the file name. Windows strips the suffix from the display to avoid PC newbies accidentally corrupting or removing it as some programmes rely it on for correct processing.

grahamlthompson said:
Not even sure which of the sidecars goes with the HD recording and which goes with the SD recording.
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In your example the SD and HD file names are different. One has '(1) ' embedded in the title the other hasn't. If they are both for the same portion of the programme then it will be the largest one that is HD. This is the same naming convention as the HDR-FOX T2/1800T/2000Ts.
 
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Like I said: with no way of injecting files into the recording section of the 5000's HDD, there is no point trying to work out what the structure of the HMT-equivalent file is or does.

grahamlthompson said:
The file names are the same, the suffixes are added by Filezilla.
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I take it he meant the suffixes are displayed (rather than added) by Filezilla - it would be very naive to believe otherwise.
 
I still don't think anyone has answered the question I posed, but invented and answered questions of their own. I give up!
Good luck in finding a way to proceed!
 
What on earth can be hard to understand about the question "Can you copy a programme off the box to a USB stick and then copy it back onto the box using the boxes copy facility?"?
Or have I not understood the question?:frantic:
 
EEPhil said:
I still don't think anyone has answered the question I posed, but invented and answered questions of their own. I give up!
Good luck in finding a way to proceed!
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It has been stated that copying from USB to HDD goes to a special folder which is not the same as the folder that recordings are made into, and therefore we can assume that imported files will not be treated the same as recorded files (imported files would not need decrypting). Without that symmetry, it's hard to see how anything can be done.

Trev said:
What on earth can be hard to understand about the question "Can you copy a programme off the box to a USB stick and then copy it back onto the box using the boxes copy facility?"?
Or have I not understood the question?:frantic:
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The answer appears to be "yes and no". Yes, video files can be imported from USB. No, they don't end up in the same place as local recordings, therefore won't be treated the same as local recordings. A neat way of avoiding our exploits while retaining the facility!
 
Black Hole said:
Like I said: with no way of injecting files into the recording section of the 5000's HDD, there is no point trying to work out what the structure of the HMT-equivalent file is or does.


I take it he meant the suffixes are displayed (rather than added) by Filezilla - it would be very naive to believe otherwise.
Click to expand...

You can presumably upload files by FTP to the recording folder, as you can download them that way. As I said might be handy for someone short of hard disk space on the box.

Trev said:
What on earth can be hard to understand about the question "Can you copy a programme off the box to a USB stick and then copy it back onto the box using the boxes copy facility?"?
Or have I not understood the question?:frantic:
Click to expand...

You can copy files from USB but not to recording folder, only to a seperate Video folder, sidecar files are not copied only the video file. The recording folder is only accessible using FTP.
 
grahamlthompson said:
You can presumably upload files by FTP to the recording folder, as you can download them that way.
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That's a very loose presumption. The FTP facility is provided by Humax, and there is absolutely no certainty it has write capability (unless somebody has tried it). If it does, that's much better than shovelling data around by USB (even if USB worked).
 
Black Hole said:
That's a very loose presumption. The FTP facility is provided by Humax, and there is absolutely no certainty it has write capability (unless somebody has tried it). If it does, that's much better than shovelling data around by USB (even if USB worked).
Click to expand...

I can easily try that. I will copy a recording set of files to PC. Delete the originals and replace them.
 
You can't copy files by ftp to the Video or Recording Folder. Going to try copying the set of files (ITV-HD recording) using Samba to the Video folder.
 
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