[tunefix] Automatic channel organisation and maintenance

[prpr]

The problem was the contradiction I have just explained. I therefore have to say I find your condescending tone somewhat uncalled for.

I find this uncalled for. As I said, I didn't write the web interface bit and, as I said, I had not spotted what you did. This is not surprising because it's something that only happens once between retune and reboot.

Just as long as people are aware that this is only possible immediately after a retune; perhaps they are, as I seem to be the first person to have raised a query about it.

It's fairly obvious that when the delete list items are actioned then the channels that have been deleted are not going to be in the tuning database any more in order to populate the Channels list box, so subsequently changing the list of things you want to delete ain't gonna make no difference.
It's also fairly obvious that all Channels will exist after a retune until you delete the ones you don't want.

I don't know what else to say on this. It's already gone on too long and I'm bored with it. If you want to carry it on, then fine, but I'm not.

 

[lashers]

I don't know what else to say on this. It's already gone on too long and I'm bored with it. If you want to carry it on, then fine, but I'm not.

OK then, we'll consider the matter closed.

 

[prpr]

what you have to do to re-instate deleted channels (Can this be done?)

Read post 177.

 

[prpr]

Well, that's definitely the way it works and it's explicit in the code so not an accident.
It could be extended to exclude channel numbers set for removal too, or removed so that all channels always show.

It's definitely bad how it is at the moment, as it's inconsistent.
I'm in two minds about which way it should go. One is useful to show you what would happen, at the risk of causing the confusion we have seen, albeit only in the window between retune and reboot; and the other gives no risk of confusion but provides no potentially useful improvement in the display.
I would probably go with extending it to exclude LCNs... if it's easy to do. If not then forget it.

 

[epsilon]

Perhaps it's time to deprecate renumber but in any case could tunefix populate that field when moving a service?

My thoughts on this are that renumber is still useful. tunefix is great at renumbering channels where the channel name is unique. Not so great when it comes to handling multiple versions of ITV & ITV +1 with a multi-region setup.

Forcing ITV to LCN 3 tends to lump each regional version of ITV onto LCN 3, I guess with similar results for ITV +1.

I had to remove the tunefix (configuration) entries and rely on renumber to handle other ITV regions. If only tunefix had a service id option...

 

[prpr]

If you flesh that out a bit, I'll think about adding it.

 

[epsilon]

If you flesh that out a bit, I'll think about adding it.

Basically, rather than just rely on the TV channel "service name" when forcing a renumber, also cross reference "usSvcId". That way, each regional variation of "ITV", "ITV +1", "ITV HD" would be renumbered correctly and the regional variations wouldn't be forced onto a single LCN.

Renumber uses a similar method but uses "usOrgLcn". There is no guarantee that regional duplicates will keep the same "original" LCN number (in the 800 / 1000 range) following a re-tune , but "usSvcId" comes from the the multiplex SI data so will not change with a retune.

You could also make it easier for the end user to identify specific ITV regional variations by including the "szNetName" for individual channels on the Tunefix settings page.

 

[Black Hole]

I've decided my multi-region HDR3 could do with a retune (want my Classic FM back!), so I am trying tunefix on it. Immediately there is a problem: the settings GUI doesn't support the multi-region option and I had to edit the file manually.

It would also be useful if the GUI supported the MUX option, because I can pick up two Wales transmitters not just one.

 

[Black Hole]

Bugger! The auto-tune has failed to pick up any services at all!!!

 

[Black Hole]

That's interesting: even a manual scan failed to pick up anything. It wasn't until I did a Factory Reset that it started working again (the auto-scan that is part of the factory reset operation is picking them up).

227 services collected, now to see if I can make tunefix sort them out the way I would like...

 

[Black Hole]

I take it the tunefix config file is applied in first-come-first-served order? If so, the GUI should put the LCN line(s) after the FORCE lines. With multi-region tuning, one can't tell where in the 800+ range the secondary region's services will be, so they need to be relocated using FORCE to the desired LCNs before the rest of the duplicates are removed. I didn't test the other way around, but I manually edited the config file to move the LCN line down, and the result after reboot is what I intended.

/mod/boot/tunefix.conf as created by GUI:

REGION|Wales
LCN|201-299,790-799,800,804-899
FORCE|801|BBC ONE Wales
FORCE|802|BBC TWO Wales
FORCE|803|ITV Wales
NAME|The Space
NAME|Christian
NAME|CONNECT*
...

/mod/boot/tunefix.conf as edited manually:

REGION|West
REGION|Wales
MUX|39,41,44
FORCE|801|BBC ONE Wales
FORCE|802|BBC TWO Wales
FORCE|803|ITV Wales
LCN|201-299,790-799,800,804-899
NAME|The Space
NAME|Christian
NAME|CONNECT*
...

/mod/boot/tunefix.conf as above, but run through the GUI and saved without modification:

REGION|Wales
LCN|201-299,790-799,800,804-899
FORCE|801|BBC ONE Wales
FORCE|802|BBC TWO Wales
FORCE|803|ITV Wales
NAME|The Space
NAME|Christian
NAME|CONNECT*
...

 

[prpr]

I've decided my multi-region HDR3 could do with a retune (want my Classic FM back!), so I am trying tunefix on it.

You could have added this in to /mod/boot/tunefix-update.conf

CLONE1|731|Classic FM|26112|2|0|1|0|1|1029|8192|1421|1421|24640|0|2|thisisglobal.com

and restarted.

the settings GUI doesn't support the multi-region option

True I'm afraid.

It would also be useful if the GUI supported the MUX option, because I can pick up two Wales transmitters not just one.

Perhaps if you talk nicely to af123...

 

[prpr]

227 services collected, now to see if I can make tunefix sort them out the way I would like...

I hope you saved a copy of /var/lib/humaxtv/channel.db before letting it loose...

I take it the tunefix config file is applied in first-come-first-served order?

Yes.

If so, the GUI should put the LCN line(s) after the FORCE lines. With multi-region tuning, one can't tell where in the 800+ range the secondary region's services will be, so they need to be relocated using FORCE to the desired LCNs before the rest of the duplicates are removed. I didn't test the other way around, but I manually edited the config file to move the LCN line down, and the result after reboot is what I intended.

Can probably do that fairly easily but I'd like to test it first, with your db and config.
Would the service id stuff mentioned around #187 help?

 

[Black Hole]

I'll need time to digest this...

 

[Black Hole]

You could have added this in to /mod/boot/tunefix-update.conf

CLONE1|731|Classic FM|26112|2|0|1|0|1|1029|8192|1421|1421|24640|0|2|thisisglobal.com

and restarted.

Classic FM was just the final straw (and a long time missing). The whole tuning database needed an overhaul. I'm not signed up to tunefix-update.

I hope you saved a copy of /var/lib/humaxtv/channel.db before letting it loose...

No, but I can easily reproduce it.

Would the service id stuff mentioned around #187 help?

I don't really see what Epsilon is driving at. In my case, the regional services are suffixed either "West" or "Wales", and any name duplications are coming from relay transmitters which duplicate the services, and need to be killed off (using MUX) rather than allocated to separate LCNs. Wouldn't that be the case wherever you are?

If so, then my scheme of forcing relevant services by name to target LCNs removes the lottery of what particular LCN (800+) they might have been on, no need to get involved with service IDs.

Can probably do that fairly easily but I'd like to test it first, with your db and config.

I'll supply whatever you require, but logically the scheme works if LCN lines are processed after FORCE lines. All it needs is to rearrange the way the GUI builds the config file, rather than any change to tunefix itself.

It would be more logical to list the muxes one wants to keep, rather than listing all the muxes except the ones to be kept. People in areas with only one transmitter in range would have no MUX line, and then all the muxes are kept. If it is necessary to maintain compatibility with existing config files, there could be a separate command for deleting all muxes except those listed, eg "KEEPMUX".

 

[prpr]

I'm not signed up to tunefix-update.

You don't need to be. You're just using the same methods in tunefix that tunefix-update does to selectively re-add channels.

I don't really see what Epsilon is driving at. In my case, the regional services are suffixed either "West" or "Wales", and any name duplications are coming from relay transmitters which duplicate the services, and need to be killed off (using MUX) rather than allocated to separate LCNs. Wouldn't that be the case wherever you are?

I believe his case was where there are two main transmitters in the same region (which have different service ids c.f. a main transmitter and a relay) and possibly a third in another region.

All it needs is to rearrange the way the GUI builds the config file, rather than any change to tunefix itself.

Yes, I know.

It would be more logical to list the muxes one wants to keep, rather than listing all the muxes except the ones to be kept. People in areas with only one transmitter in range would have no MUX line, and then all the muxes are kept.

I'm not sure about that, espcially with the musical mux-channel hopping that's going to be happening in the next 3-4 years. Much better to tell it to delete what you know you don't want rather than to have to keep updating what you want to keep.

 

[Black Hole]

I believe his case was where there are two main transmitters in the same region (which have different service ids c.f. a main transmitter and a relay) and possibly a third in another region.

The main transmitters are still going to be on different channel numbers, so that is resolved by MUX. The only case I can think of where service IDs are a necessary supplement to service names is if services carry differing regional content without being differentiated by name - does anyone have a specific example of this?

 

[prpr]

The only case I can think of where service IDs are a necessary supplement to service names is if services carry differing regional content without being differentiated by name - does anyone have a specific example of this?

"ITV" and "ITV +1" in England.

 

[Black Hole]

OK, I take it back. That's annoying.

Obviously there's no harm in extra features, but service IDs are going to be hard to make friendly.

 

[prpr]

tunefix is great at renumbering channels where the channel name is unique. Not so great when it comes to handling multiple versions of ITV & ITV +1 with a multi-region setup.

Forcing ITV to LCN 3 tends to lump each regional version of ITV onto LCN 3, I guess with similar results for ITV +1.

I had to remove the tunefix (configuration) entries and rely on renumber to handle other ITV regions. If only tunefix had a service id option...

Tunefix 1.5.0 implements a service ID option (advanced feature, not supported by GUI settings editor).
Documentation updated: https://hummy.tv/forum/posts/97069