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Assume v. Presume

gomezz

Well-Known Member
The other artificiality is that the start of the calendar defines a different season on the other side of the world.
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Yep. The measurements I described still work wherever you are (except in the Arctic and Antarctic Circles of course); declaring 1st March as the first day of Spring doesn't.
 

Trev

The Dumb One
I suppose they call it the first day of Autumn in Oz. Or perhaps they are not as stupid as our BBC met men.
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
I suppose they call it the first day of Autumn in Oz. Or perhaps they are not as stupid as our BBC met men.
I fail to understand why they do it, unless they really are trying to migrate everybody else to their agenda. I have noticed it every season for the last year or so: they come on and (last year) say something like "today is the first day of Spring". I complained about it to the BBC and the Met.Office, and now they say "today is the first day of meteorological Spring", when really I want them to shut up about it (why say anything at all?) and save it for 21st March (not that I believe I was the reason for the change).
 

EEPhil

Number 28
It's all part of the bad science agenda. Pillocks being interviewed about how the temperature is twice the normal February average (or something similar). BS! It may be ten degrees Celsius warmer that the average - because there is a wind blowing up from the Azores (I think). It isn't double. Don't forget "It's the warmest [insert month here] since records began". When did records begin? That is conveniently missing in many reports, and only a short while ago in some others. Could the choice of when records began have an ulterior motive? Are they defining meteorological spring so as to fudge some other statistics?
 

MikeSh

Well-Known Member
Could the choice of when records began have an ulterior motive?
There is generally just the one motive - money. They get headlines, interest, kudos, advertising revenue, stay in business / pay the bosses more.
No mystery required :)
 

Trev

The Dumb One
how the temperature is twice the normal February average
Of course it's twice as hot. 20 is twice 10.
Ah, lets do that in Fahrenheit. 68/50 = . So now it's only 1.36 times as hot.
Ah again, let's do that in Kelvin 293/283= 1.035, so now it's only 1.035 times as hot hardly any increase at all.
Bollox. That throws my twice as hot theory right out of the window. :frantic:
 

prpr

Well-Known Member
The way to trap the stupid is to ask them how many times hotter 5 degrees is than freezing or 0 degrees. This usually blows their brain cell.
 

gomezz

Well-Known Member
Something I don't know: Does an increase of 1K mean the same increase in energy no matter where on the scale that it happens, ie near absolute zero or the freezing or boiling point of water etc?
 

Trev

The Dumb One
IIRC, when I was at school a long time ago , one calorie was the amount of energy required to raise 1gm of water through 1 degree C (K). Therefore it is independent of where on the temperature scale you are referencing. At least between 0 and 100C). There are now probably SI units that say pretty much the same thing.
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Something I don't know: Does an increase of 1K mean the same increase in energy no matter where on the scale that it happens, ie near absolute zero or the freezing or boiling point of water etc?
Yes, on an absolute thermodynamic scale of temperature (which Kelvin is) as opposed to scales based on the assumption a liquid expands linearly with temperature (Fahrenheit, Celsius).

when I was at school a long time ago , one calorie was the amount of energy required to raise 1gm of water through 1 degree C (K).
Still is. Bear in mind the "calorie" referred to in food is actually a kilo-calorie.
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Yes. You will see them described in the blurb on food packaging as "kcals".

2000 kcals consumption per day is about the same power as required to run a 100W light bulb.
 
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prpr

Well-Known Member
And for completeness:
100 W for 24 hours = 24 x 60 x 60 x 100 = 8640000 J = 8640 kJ
2000 kCal = 4.186 x 1000 x 2000 = 8372000 J = 8372 kJ

4.186 being the specific heat capacity of water (and the conversion factor from Calories to Joules).
 

EEPhil

Number 28
There is generally just the one motive - money. They get headlines, interest, kudos, advertising revenue, stay in business / pay the bosses more.
No mystery required :)
Been there! Pure research looks into whether something is viable or not. Either result is the right result. You can only get one or two publications from showing something doesn't work. But when the research funding depends on it., the only "right" result is the one that attracts more money (and more publications). Never was very good at spinning a load of 💩 and pretending it was gold. Perhaps that's why I never got very far in academia. :D
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Ye gods! I was out last night, and the MC said something like "welcome to the first Sunday in Spring", and my friend said it said so in her diary. Clearly this 1st March thing has spread further than I was aware of. :mad:
 
OP
Black Hole

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
News coverage yesterday: "the most destrusive tornado for nearly..." (I was expecting some large number at this point, with bated breath) "...two years!"

Not that unusual then! What an anticlimax.
 
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