• The forum software that supports hummy.tv has been upgraded to XenForo 2.3!

    Please bear with us as we continue to tweak things, and feel free to post any questions, issues or suggestions in the upgrade thread.

Many recordings have wrong synopsis

I have a Foxsat-HDR as well, same suggestion.
Thanks, that's very helpful. I've scheduled the following for AR on my FOXSAT-HDR, across all the HD channels I've tuned, only two of them overlap, all series recording, except for Click.

Code:
Date/time             Channel      Title
--------------------- ------------ --------------------------------
Thu 26 Nov 2015 03:30 BBC News HD  Click
Thu 26 Nov 2015 17:15 BBC One HD   Pointless
Thu 26 Nov 2015 19:00 ITV HD       Emmerdale
Thu 26 Nov 2015 21:00 BBC Two HD   The Last Kingdom
Thu 26 Nov 2015 21:00 Channel 4 HD The World's Most Expensive Food
Thu 26 Nov 2015 22:30 BBC Three HD Rent a Cop
Fri 27 Nov 2015 00:35 BBC Four HD  Detectorists
Fri 27 Nov 2015 21:00 BBC Two HD   Great Continental Railway Journeys
 
This is reminiscent of a couple of years ago with HDR-FOX, when some people (including me) had poor experience of AR when others didn't (even on the same transmitter). My experience suddenly improved, coincidentally at around the same time as when the box threw a wobbly and forgot all its settings, starting from the installation wizard again (ie equivalent to a restore factory defaults operation).
 
Perhaps I should try to convince adrianf36 to extend hmt with a "+setsynopsis" command line parameter :).
You can try to convince me if you like but free time for me is not as abundant as it once was, so unless there's a greater demand for this than just yourself it's unlikely to happen any time soon I'm afraid.

Do any other Foxsat HDR Custom Firmware users think this would be useful?

Oh, and just to throw my hat into the ring re. AR, I've always used this for all my recordings ever since I've had the box and would say that well over 98% of things record without any issue whatsoever. Those that don't tend to be Channel 5 programmes!
 
So you don't experience that all recordings start 5-60s late? That's what I saw when I tried AR.
Could your problems with AR be due to the time on you Humax being incorrect? e.g. The recording starts 60 seconds late because the clock is 60 seconds slow
 
Could your problems with AR be due to the time on you Humax being incorrect? e.g. The recording starts 60 seconds late because the clock is 60 seconds slow

Doesn't seem likely, the box wakes up about 15 mins before an accurate recording is due to start, 60 seconds would make virtually no difference. Afaik it waits for the broadcaster to signal the start of the recording, which can be any time from 15 mins before the scheduled start time to the scheduled end time of the recording. If no start recording is received at this time the box generates a failed recording. This will happen when for some reason the programme isn't transmitted.
 
Update Pointless started at BBC Channel Of The Year just before opening titles, Emmerdale at new ITV logo. No content lost from either. Next recordings due to start in about 2 minutes. Both programmes started at scheduled times. Strangely though no prog info on the ITV one (could be down to convertfiles running will need to check tomorrow.
 
Update Pointless started at BBC Channel Of The Year just before opening titles, Emmerdale at new ITV logo. No content lost from either. Next recordings due to start in about 2 minutes. Both programmes started at scheduled times. Strangely though no prog info on the ITV one (could be down to convertfiles running will need to check tomorrow.
This is what I have so far:
Code:
Date/time             Channel      Title                              Start            Stop                            # EPG Blocks Synopsis
--------------------- ------------ ---------------------------------- ---------------- ------------------------------- ------------ -------------------------
Thu 26 Nov 2015 03:30 BBC News HD  Click                              30s early        4m late                         1            Correct
Thu 26 Nov 2015 17:15 BBC One HD   Pointless                          On time, logo    On time, next logo              2            Correct
Thu 26 Nov 2015 19:00 ITV HD       Emmerdale                          On time, logo    Complete but before next logo   1            Incorrect (prev. program)
Thu 26 Nov 2015 21:00 BBC Two HD   The Last Kingdom                   On time, logo    On time, next logo              1            Correct
Thu 26 Nov 2015 21:00 Channel 4 HD The World's Most Expensive Food    4s late 21:02:24 Complete, 3s of next program    1            Correct
Thu 26 Nov 2015 22:30 BBC Three HD Rent a Cop                         On time, logo    On time, next logo              1            Correct

Summary:

One incorrect synopsis: Emmerdale on ITV HD, synopsis is for previous program.
One program started and stopped late: The World's Most Expensive Food on Channel 4 HD. It started 21:02:24, at least some seconds late, the other program scheduled for 21:00 started 21:00:21 on BBC Two HD so this doesn't explain that the box would be busy waiting for "broadcast start signals".
One program stopped slightly early, at least before next logo.
 
That all looks about normal to me. All the complaints about timing and synopsis data can be put down to the broadcaster.
 
ITV must have had an issue with the synopses data. There is none on my Foxsat also missing in Webif.

Worlds Most Expensive Food recorded 21:02 - 22:03. Missed start of programme (Channel 4 screwed up)

Rent a Cop recorded 22:31 - 23:02 Started with BBC 3 logo - No content lost

The Last Kingdom recorded 21:00-22:00 Started at BBC2 logo - No content lost

Detectorists recorded 00:36 to 01:06 Started at BBC 4 logo - No content lost

I have recorded a lot of Channel 4 HD movies - none of them have any missing content.

I don't understand the comment re BBC 2 HD, the programme started recording a few seconds late, so did the actual transmission. AR worked as it should have starting recording at the correct time at the BBC logo just prior to the actual programme. As did the Last Kingdom and Detectorists. Both recording and broadcast started late which shows AR is working as it should

Which programme stopped early ?
 
Last edited:
Perfect example tonight, On BBC2-HD SCD it takes two delayed by approx. 30 minutes due to Davis Cup coverage of Andy Murray match. AR coped as designed, complete programme recorded. Auto padding would have failed miserably. :eek:
 
I don't understand the comment re BBC 2 HD, the programme started recording a few seconds late, so did the actual transmission. AR worked as it should have starting recording at the correct time at the BBC logo just prior to the actual programme. As did the Last Kingdom and Detectorists. Both recording and broadcast started late which shows AR is working as it should

Which programme stopped early ?
Sorry for not being clear. The Last Kingdom started "on time" in terms of the beginning of the program. What I meant was that two programs were scheduled for 21:00 so this could have been an explanation for one program starting recording 4s late in relation to the broadcast. But the Channel 4 HD program start was already 2m later than the BBC Two HD one so this was no excuse for the box to start the second recording late.

The remaining two programs:
Code:
Date/time             Channel      Title                              Start            Stop                            # EPG Blocks Synopsis
--------------------- ------------ ---------------------------------- ---------------- ------------------------------- ------------ -------------------------
Fri 27 Nov 2015 00:35 BBC Four HD  Detectorists                       On time, logo    Complete but before next logo   1            Correct
Fri 27 Nov 2015 21:00 BBC Two HD   Great Continental Railway Journeys On time, logo    On time, next logo              1            Correct
Summary: 1 recording out of 8 started late (albeit only by 4s but still late), which in my view is a failure rate of 12.5%, not very impressive. No recording stopped early. This is still a lot better from what I saw some days ago, where most started late. I'll schedule some more test programs on weekday afternoons and keep an eye on these.
 
Sorry for not being clear. The Last Kingdom started "on time" in terms of the beginning of the program. What I meant was that two programs were scheduled for 21:00 so this could have been an explanation for one program starting recording 4s late in relation to the broadcast. But the Channel 4 HD program start was already 2m later than the BBC Two HD one so this was no excuse for the box to start the second recording late.

The remaining two programs:
Code:
Date/time             Channel      Title                              Start            Stop                            # EPG Blocks Synopsis
--------------------- ------------ ---------------------------------- ---------------- ------------------------------- ------------ -------------------------
Fri 27 Nov 2015 00:35 BBC Four HD  Detectorists                       On time, logo    Complete but before next logo   1            Correct
Fri 27 Nov 2015 21:00 BBC Two HD   Great Continental Railway Journeys On time, logo    On time, next logo              1            Correct
Summary: 1 recording out of 8 started late (albeit only by 4s but still late), which in my view is a failure rate of 12.5%, not very impressive. No recording stopped early. This is still a lot better from what I saw some days ago, where most started late. I'll schedule some more test programs on weekday afternoons and keep an eye on these.

A tad confused, how can you expect a lossy delivery system that the smallest time interval you can resolve is in the number of frames compressed into a group of pictures (GOP) to be accurate to the degree you expect. To make digital TV possible requires lossy mpeg compression, Basically you have a single frame (an I frame), followed by subsequent data that records the difference to the iframe, that allows the subsequent frames within the to be rebuilt (P frames). The higher the bitrate the less video information is lost in the compression process.

Lets compare the average bitrate used by the BBC for HD (which arguably have the best current HD encoders), and are able to share the available bitrate depending on content (rapid movement requires a higher bitrate because the more difference there are between frames needs more data to identify the difference. (A static image (like a photograph has no difference so is very easy to compress).

BBC -HD uses about 7Mbps for it's HD service. In rough terms that's about 7/8 Megabytes/Second. (One byte is 8 bits). One hour of BBC HD would require roughly 3150 Megabytes of hard disk storage (approx. 3.15 GB which is very close to the actual storage requirement).

Now to the actual data that is output from the HDMI socket to your TV.

You have a display that has 1920 x 1080 pixels, each one requires three separate colour information data, 8 bits each for Red, Green and Blue (24 bits in total) 24 bits for each pixel. HDR 4K displays use 10 bit pixels).

That equates to more than 64 million colour combinations.

The data rate required to transmit the amount of data to produce a uncompressed 25 frames/second picture in HD is 1920 x 1080 (pixels) x 24 (Bits/pixel) x 25 (frames/second), which is about 1240 Mbps. Work out for yourself how much of the original digital data is left.

Basically the message is you cannot resolve a mpeg compressed transmission any higher than the basic GOP length without any sort of consideration of the other factors involved.

In the end AR works just fine for me. Why anyone would want any more accuracy baffles me,
 
A tad confused, how can you expect a lossy delivery system that the smallest time interval you can resolve is in the number of frames compressed into a group of pictures (GOP) to be accurate to the degree you expect. To make digital TV possible requires lossy mpeg compression, Basically you have a single frame (an I frame), followed by subsequent data that records the difference to the iframe, that allows the subsequent frames within the to be rebuilt (P frames). The higher the bitrate the less video information is lost in the compression process.

Lets compare the average bitrate used by the BBC for HD (which arguably have the best current HD encoders), and are able to share the available bitrate depending on content (rapid movement requires a higher bitrate because the more difference there are between frames needs more data to identify the difference. (A static image (like a photograph has no difference so is very easy to compress).

BBC -HD uses about 7Mbps for it's HD service. In rough terms that's about 7/8 Megabytes/Second. (One byte is 8 bits). One hour of BBC HD would require roughly 3150 Megabytes of hard disk storage (approx. 3.15 GB which is very close to the actual storage requirement).

Now to the actual data that is output from the HDMI socket to your TV.

You have a display that has 1920 x 1080 pixels, each one requires three separate colour information data, 8 bits each for Red, Green and Blue (24 bits in total) 24 bits for each pixel. HDR 4K displays use 10 bit pixels).

That equates to more than 64 million colour combinations.

The data rate required to transmit the amount of data to produce a uncompressed 25 frames/second picture in HD is 1920 x 1080 (pixels) x 24 (Bits/pixel) x 25 (frames/second), which is about 1240 Mbps. Work out for yourself how much of the original digital data is left.

Basically the message is you cannot resolve a mpeg compressed transmission any higher than the basic GOP length without any sort of consideration of the other factors involved.

In the end AR works just fine for me. Why anyone would want any more accuracy baffles me,
I don't understand how broadcast bitrate is relevant to AR? If AR often cuts a program recording short (by starting late or stopping early) that is of no use to me and I would have to use padding instead. I realize that I would miss out on delayed broadcasts but it seems that the risk of that is a lot less than the quite high risk of AR being inaccurate.

It's good that AR works for other viewers but based on the above tests it's not good enough for me. It seems to work fine on Freeview but what I've demonstrated here is that it doesn't work as well on Freesat.
 
Last edited:
Summary: 1 recording out of 8 started late (albeit only by 4s but still late), which in my view is a failure rate of 12.5%, not very impressive. No recording stopped early. This is still a lot better from what I saw some days ago, where most started late. I'll schedule some more test programs on weekday afternoons and keep an eye on these.
Four seconds is unacceptably late? I don't think AR was ever intended as a mechanism to make transcription copies of broadcast programmes. This seems terribly fussy.
 
Nonsense. It's about 7 megabits/second.

You got that right at least, but it has no bearing on the above.

Pardon 7 Mbps is 7 Megabits per second. Divide by 8 to get Megabytes per second. 7 MBps would be 7 Megabytes per second. Sorry it's your replay that is nonsense. b is bit, B is Byte.

A GOP length for digital TV is normally about 12 frames so the best possible accuracy is around 0.5 seconds.
 
Back
Top