Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
According to reports today, the alerts kept coming in into the night. I suspect these were "catch up" responses when the phone in question moved into a new area.
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Today's 3pm emergency alert
- Thread starter trog
- Start date
Owen Smith
Well-Known Member
Except it didn't arrive on my mum's 4G/5G iPhone on Three, nor my 4G iPad on Three.
Owen Smith
Well-Known Member
Compact push button phones will outlive 3G, since all those phones work on 2G as well and 2G has a few years left.
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
Oh! I didn't realise that.
EEPhil
Number 28
Great!
Well, if the OS isn't updated here's hoping that the phone and applications will continue to work when the OS updates cease. Especially those apps that I'm finding useful (banking, GP records -not NHS app - utilities etc). Most of the associated websites have stopped working on the ancient laptop and most wouldn't update at all on the iPhone.
EEPhil
Number 28
That's annoying, getting that racket in the middle of the night. Have we all got to power down the phone, go into airplane mode or turn off the notifications? Hopefully this will be one of the test results that will be looked into and the behaviour tweaked.
Owen Smith
Well-Known Member
SMETS 2 smart meters in the south of the UK report over the 2G mobile network, so it can't be turned off yet. In the north of the UK there's an independent low frequency radio network. What needs to happen in the south is the comms module on enough electricity meters need swapping to 4G/5G capable ones. It doesn't need to be all of them because the meters can talk to each other and piggy back off each others comms (all smart gas meters go via an electricity meter anyway). The north/south divide goes through Yorkshire, which annoyingly mean it isn't clear which scheme my parents are on.
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
Where does a "smart" gas meter get it's electricity supply?
Owen Smith
Well-Known Member
A battery, which goes flat in 5 to 10 years. There's a button on a smart gas meter to display the reading to reduce consumption. When the battery is getting flat the meter tells the network, but those messages are universally ignored. Then when it goes flat completely they send an engineer out to swap the meter, the batteries are replaceable but evidence suggests that is rarely done. The householder can't swap the battery themselves, alas. So that's more expense and waste, my current gas meter was installed in 1999 but none of these smart meters will last anything like that long.
Smart water meters are coming next (also with a battery) and those are completely independent of the combined gas/electricity reporting network. Yorkshire Water now install a smart meter for any new supply. They're more common in the south because the regular readings on a smart water meter can be used to identify water leaks eg. a constant low level consumption even in the middle of the night. The south has bigger water shortage problems so this matters more to them.
What I don't understand is why can't the gas flow or water flow be used to charge something like a super capacitor to avoid batteries. Super capacitors are good enough they could potentially last about a year without being charged, you have to account for supplies that have extended periods of not being used.
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Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
There must be many ways to harvest energy for this kind of low-average-power functionality, I've read of plenty of things in the pipeline but I guess they're not yet mainstream or are prohibitively expensive. The pocket calculator I keep by my desk runs from a solar cell.
The idea that these meters contain a non-replaceable (practically) battery is another good reason for me not to have them.
RobH1
Well-Known Member
Owen, that is very interesting. We spent 3 months abroad this winter and both our smart-arse meters stopped communicating. I wondered why we were apparently using no gas during the cold spell! The gas meter counter was also seized.
Both meters fitted in a new build 4 years previously. They replaced them.
I anticipated a row with British Gas over their estimated bill (we pay quarterly), but they virtually wrote off the energy used over 4 months. Well pleased with that.
Both meters fitted in a new build 4 years previously. They replaced them.
I anticipated a row with British Gas over their estimated bill (we pay quarterly), but they virtually wrote off the energy used over 4 months. Well pleased with that.
MikeSh
Well-Known Member
Yes. They know there were problems with Three and it's being investigated - and hopefully diagnosed and fixed.
That one reason to do a test like this.
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
I imagine it's very hard to investigate a problem without sending out more alerts!
" many people on the 3 network also failed to get it." You were included in that "many" then.
10 more years for 2G it seems and 3G switch off depends on which company you use.
The Phase Out Plans for 3G Mobile
➤ Vodafone UK will start to phase out 3G this month and aims to complete by December 2023.
➤ Three UK said they’ll be phasing out our 3G network service gradually over the next 2 years and switching it off by the end of 2024.
➤ EE (BT) will this year begin moving customers off 3G rather than switching the network off, but they aim to switch it off in early 2024.
➤ O2 (Virgin Media) informed us that they’ve yet to announce a public sunsetting timeframe, but will adhere to the 2033 date (O2 operates a lot of 2G based Smart Meters in homes).
Owen Smith
Well-Known Member
Agreed, the waste (and extra traffic on the roads to do it) constantly replacing all these meters is criminal. Personally I don't understand why many people feel it is so important to have constant meter readings, I manage fine reading mine about 4 times a year. The estimated bill will be corrected to the real usage anyway.
However if your meter is deemed as requiring replacing to remain accurate you cannot refuse. You can ask for a non smart meter and if they've still got some they might give you one, but you can't insist. The right to refuse smart meter installation expires when your old meter is life expired. My gas meter from 1999 is probably overdue to be honest. At least my electricity meter is only 11 years old.
Owen Smith
Well-Known Member
That's criminally wasteful, non smart meters last a couple of decades. Here we are drowning in electrical waste and with an overheating planet, and yet we wilfully create more waste and emit more CO2 replacing the waste items.
MikeSh
Well-Known Member
You're assuming the old meter is scrapped. It seems more likely they will refurbish it, fit a new battery, calibrate it and then put it back in stock, just like the old meters (less the battery). Very likely the one you get would actually be a refurbished one.
MikeSh
Well-Known Member
Agreed, though hopefully they can keep those 'in house' unlike a recent test in the US that got sent to the wrong system by mistake.
Florida apologises for sending pre-dawn emergency alert test
The gov have said these tests won't be a regular thing but I suspect they'll become an annual fixture. If you don't test regularly, like for fire alarms, you can't have real confidence it'll work when you need it.
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
It's being pushed as a means to monitor your instantaneous power usage and thus economise, but actually it's a back door for variable pricing (which is currently being trialled, offering discounts to those with smart meters if they turn off during peak demand). The point is that if the demand can be evened out, the generators and the grid need less capacity for peaks.