Trev
The Dumb One
And CO2 destroying humanity and banning licensed handguns which has done nothing to reduce the number of unlicensed handguns, but ruined a great pastime for quite a few peeps.
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Interesting Items...
- Thread starter Black Hole
- Start date
D
Deleted member 473
Not everyone exposed to it dies of asbestosis, so think yourself lucky.You mean the black dusty asbestos laden mess? Well until they banned asbestos and substituted it with something that wears out discs/drums nearly as quickly as the pads/linings. I remember in my youth when I worked in a garage, we used to blow out the dust with an air line.
Fake Asbestos Brake Pads: An Imported Mesothelioma Risk
Asbestos ghosts from our industrial past continue to haunt the modern world. A retired vehicle mechanic who had worked in the garage trade changing car brake pads made of asbestos since the 1960s and 70s, has recently loss his life to malignant mesothelioma.
The story is a tragically familiar one. In a written statement, the former car mechanic, who died aged 67 less than a year after a confirmed diagnosis, describes how it was “normal in the trade for the brake dust in the drums to be blown out with an airline, so that it was always in the air”. As a result, asbestos dust “covered everything and everyone in the factory” and “no-one wore masks or any kind of safety equipment”.
Up to 35 per cent of a brake lining product can contain asbestos fibres used to supply structural reinforcement and heat resistance. Repeated friction releases microscopic asbestos fibres into the atmosphere and large amounts of asbestos material is trapped inside the brake housing or clutch space, which is then released when replacement or repair work is carried out.
Many employers failed to provide protective equipment
Despite the introduction of asbestos regulations throughout British industry in 1969, which aimed to reduce occupational exposure wherever asbestos was used, in reality many employers failed to provide protective equipment, clothing or health information.
Vehicle brake pads and cylinder linings manufactured from asbestos fibres, were first developed in 1902 and were largely phased out after the arrival of front-wheel drive vehicles in the 1980s, which also saw the UK ban on using the most dangerous brown and blue asbestos fibres. Nevertheless, some motor industry insiders say that in some countries, they are still sometimes used in higher-end vehicles and available on the spare parts “after sales” market.
As asbestos awareness of the human cost became more accepted more than 50 countries around the world eventually followed Britain and the US in prohibiting the import and use of the toxic fibres. However, white chrysotile asbestos was not prohibited in the UK for another 15 years and could still be used in many applications, including automobile assembly friction products, such as brake pads, disc brakes, clutches and gaskets.
Counterfeit brake pads
Around the world, asbestos fibres can still be found in a number of brake pad products being produced by non-OEM (original equipment manufacturers), especially among developing nations, such as China. In 2013, China produced 420,000 metric tons of asbestos – the 2nd highest manufacturing source of products using asbestos fibres and Australia appears to be a target market for China’s asbestos brake pads and linings.
It was recently reported that counterfeit “Toyota” brake pads made with asbestos and designed to fit more than 500,000 of their vehicles currently on Australian roads were discovered in genuine branded packaging. Toyota, who are the world’s largest car maker, recently announced dealers and independent mechanics in Australia may have unwittingly installed thousands of fake brake pads containing asbestos on a range of vehicles, including HiAce models (2005-2015) and HiLux models (2004-2015).
Australia banned asbestos in 2004, yet the illegal brake pads containing the deadly fibres from China keep entering Australia. Despite guarantees of compliance with Australian standards, since 2009, nearly 25,000 Chinese cars from two different manufacturers imported into Australia were discovered to contain asbestos fibres in nearly 30 different engine gaskets and also in the exhaust system.
Cause and effect link between asbestos brake dust and mesothelioma
So are there illegal asbestos containing brake pads in Britain? It’s highly unlikely that quality name brand brake pads and linings sold at reputable national outlets would be compromised but cheap import auto products found online could contain asbestos. Vintage and classic cars arguably could possibly retain original working parts contaminated with asbestos.
The potential health risks still remain. Recent research in the Occupational and Environmental Health sector has taken a further look at whether there is evidence to show that sufficient asbestos is present in brake linings to eventually cause mesothelioma.
Forensic analysis and observational evaluation of patterns of risk, cause and effect have led researchers to conclude that “there is a ‘net’ of evidence which suggests a ‘cause and effect’ link between brake dust-associated white asbestos exposure and mesothelioma”.
This latest conclusion adds to previous assessments of chrysotile as a Class 1 cancer-causing agent. While exposure to white asbestos may be considered ‘low risk’ compared to the brown and blue types, nevertheless, there is still not a safe level of exposure established, below which white asbestos is not a threat to long term health, including dust from brake pad linings.
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I just used to spray brake cleaner everywhere (once the pads/shoes were out!) and let it wash the dust down into a tray. Mind you I was trained by an engineer - we used three different types of grease when reassembling drums and I have to say that I've never had brakes as good since.
My current car has regenerative braking so it slows down fairly well just by taking my foot off the throttle but I often have to put my foot on the brake pedal just to put the brake lights on so alert cars behind.
EEPhil
Number 28
We used to have one or two. Very good for putting in the oven and placing Kilner Jars on when bottling our own tomatoes.
1) I used to empty engine oil into a tray and then paint the fence with it. Better than creosote. I suppose both are frowned upon now.
2) Yes, letting the idiot behind know what you're doing is rather important.
OP
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
Just taking your foot off the gas shouldn't engage braking, traditional or regenerative.
EEPhil
Number 28
I thought it sounded odd, but I don't know enough about it to be certain.
Engine braking, when you take your foot of the accelerator pedal, certainly occurs.
I get the feeling somebody is taking the pee here. At the bottom of this page I'm finding an advert:
Ezra Pound
Well-Known Member
I was glad to see that it is still frowned upon to be 'Off-Topic' even in an Hummy Arms thread, (See link Here), so there is still hope for this thread to get back on track at some time in the future
prpr
Well-Known Member
I had one of those too - I think it came from an industrial oven or something like that. Obtained by the father of one of my classmates who must've been in that line of employment. Mine went to the tip, on mother's instructions after about 5 years, still in perfect condition.
OP
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
Isn't asbestos interesting?
That's the joy of [Google] Sense (or whatever they call it), detecting us talking about a subject and then targeting ads at it.
I probably used the wrong term but as I understand it, when the throttle is closed (and the car is coasting), the power management increases the charge voltage of the alternator (I've also seen it called the excitation voltage) which increases the drag and causes the car to slow faster without braking in addition to boosting the battery (the effect is certainly noticeable as I can turn the system off and observe the difference). Then in the subsequent acceleration phase, the alternator is effectively decoupled, saving both brake pad wear and fuel.
One of the drawbacks of looking beyond the end of my bonnet and anticipating events is that I don't use my brakes half as often as people around me seem to.
EEPhil
Number 28
At the risk of being off-topic: I would have thought that the logical progression of an "interesting" topic, from electric car pollution to brakes to asbestos and even to the targetting of ads about asbestos, is on-topic. The linked page on the "Router" thread was very off-topic.
Big Brother is watching us!
EEPhil
Number 28
Indeed, I used to have a similar problem. If you are driving at the appropriate speed in the correct gear and anticipating events you shouldn't need to apply the brakes frequently. Unfortunately, many drivers are not very observant and will continue at 70+mph up your rear end if you don't give them a clue! In the days when it was not strictly legal to use hazard lights whilst moving, I often did if I came across queued traffic on a dual carriageway or motorway, especially when there was a bend obscuring the view.
I knew I'd used the wrong term - http://www.audi.ie/ie/web/en/models/layer/technology/recuperation.html
D
Deleted member 473
If it does that, it is not very well designed. It should not start to really slow down until you put your foot on the brake pedal. Regenerative braking is only any use for hybrids, electric cars, trolley cars or F1, the electric motor goes into reverse and charges the hybrid battery, slowing the vehicle. When coasting, speed should be maintained in a well designed car, using a trickle of charge from the hybrid battery.
Ah, a poorly designed, half baked system indeed, but what else to expect from VAG? I bet they even faked the 3% saving!
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D
Deleted member 473
Better to tip it down the drains to give them a good protective coating of used engine oil.
EEPhil
Number 28
That really is bad for the environment. The sewers are full of fat and grease as it is - no need for any more.
At least painting a fence protects the fence.
I thought coasting (where there is no drive linkage between the engine and the wheels) was frowned upon.
It would seem coasting must have a different meaning when applied to electric vehicles.
D
Deleted member 473
In that the electric motor is always engaged, it isn't coasting, but put it in neutral and it would be. We are talking about automatics here. As long as mine is in Drive or Reverse, it isn't coasting.
D
Deleted member 473
Yes, I asumed that was what you meant, and I continued with the same term.
So all the Audi has is a more powerful alternator to charge the battery? It should only kick in when you depress the foot brake, else it is wasting fuel by slowing you down. Also, most of the time, your battery is already going to be charged, so what happens then?
So all the Audi has is a more powerful alternator to charge the battery? It should only kick in when you depress the foot brake, else it is wasting fuel by slowing you down. Also, most of the time, your battery is already going to be charged, so what happens then?