Recording Failed: Not being saved

I use the remote scheduling feature of the custom firmware to search for programmes that interest me based on either programme name, cast members or presenters, all is working fine, except for ...

One particular programme I enjoy is The Chase, this is set by the EPG on the recorder itself, my Humax is set to pad the recording by starting five minutes early and stop five minutes after the schedule is timed to end, this allows for slight discrepancies in broadcast timings

It is unusual for me now to watch a programme as it is being broadcast, but I was around to see the Humax Fox start recording, clicked to view the EPG and as usual, The Chase is showing as being recorded, when I came back to chase play (start watching while still being recorded) I looked through the Media - Video list, no The Chase folder, nothing, nowhere could I find where The Chase was being recorded, as the recording had only just started (about three minutes) it should have appeared somewhere, I stopped the recorded, changed to CH3 (ITV) and just set a manual record just as the programme begins, check the Media - Video list again and after about one minute, The Chase appears with a red dot at the root level

Next day same scenario, red ring showing a recording being saved, but no The Chase folder, nothing, so did a manual record again and had a thought, what I found using Solar-PUTTY to Telnet in to the box, was a stray file called The Chase, folders show in my preferences as blue, this was showing as white like regular recordings at the root level, I then went looking using FileZilla, FTP'd to the Humax and deleted the stray file 'The Chase', (yes I could have deleted the file from the Telnet session)

Wanting to make sure that the culprit had been identified, I looked at the EPG and chose a programme that was about to start, created a series link schedule, then created a text file with the programme name, uploaded it to the Humax Fox, then renamed it by removing the .txt extension, waited and waited, low and behold, the TV showed that a recording had commenced, after waiting the minute for the recording to show, I checked the EPG which showed a red dot next to the chosen programme, I then went to the Media - Video list, and sure enough, nothing was being saved

I hope this may be of help to others when recordings appear to fail

This is one possible reason, there may be other reasons why your scheduled recording fails to record
 

prpr

Well-Known Member
Creating a file with the same name as you want a directory to be created with (or vice-versa) causes all sorts of hassles, and not just on the T2...
 

MikeSh

Well-Known Member
So does this mean if you make a one-off recording of a series programme and leave it in the root, then set up a series record for the same - it won't save?
🤔
No, surely not. I'm sure I've done that more than once and it's worked. What am I missing?
 

Trev

The Dumb One
The Chase also probably had the name Tipping Point because you used 5 mins padding so started recording whilst TP was still on.
 

prpr

Well-Known Member
So does this mean if you make a one-off recording of a series programme and leave it in the root, then set up a series record for the same - it won't save?
No, because the files all have extensions (.ts, .nts, .hmt, .thm) and a date/time stamp. But if they were somehow to get removed...
 
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The Chase also probably had the name Tipping Point because you used 5 mins padding so started recording whilst TP was still on.
Not always the case, it does show the info of the previous programme if you do get info, until the crossover point in the schedule, if it was the case, then you would find folders created all over the place
 

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
The Chase also probably had the name Tipping Point because you used 5 mins padding so started recording whilst TP was still on.
Only if you record by pressing the record button or as a manual timer schedule entry. If the schedule entry is made through the EPG (and not subsequently modified by manual editing) the recordings will have the appropriate file and media list names.

when I came back to chase play (start watching while still being recorded)
You could have done that without searching for a recording file: while a recording is being made, switch to the relevant channel live and then you can use trick play as if the channel had been live since the start of the recording.

nowhere could I find where The Chase was being recorded
I cannot imagine why that might be, and therefore am unwilling to believe it without hard evidence (as opposed to anecdote). What you need is a time-stamped command-line recursive directory listing of My Video during a recording and then after it.

I hope this may be of help to others when recordings appear to fail
How is this a help? How can it be applied after an event, even if it's real?
 
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So does this mean if you make a one-off recording of a series programme and leave it in the root, then set up a series record for the same - it won't save?
if you do a one-off recording of a series programme, it will appear in the root directory, because a one-off recording of a series is no longer a series recording schedule, it is a one-off, but though it shows just the file name, this is the descriptor name, the actual filename actually includes the date and time of the recording, for example the series folder 'The Chase' and the name of a programme stored in it the main video stream 'New_ The Chase_20200207_1655.ts', (I have newk installed 'Automatically kill series name prefixes like 'New:'')

'New_ The Chase_20200207_1655.ts', 'New_ The Chase' the file name, '20200207' the date as Year Month Day, and 1655 the time, '.ts' the file extension, there are two additional files, '.nts' and '.hmt' a forth file is created once a file has been viewed '.thm'

There is also a hidden file '.series' created to signify a series, viewable using the 'File Editor' option in the 'Diag' folder, this file is the reason why you sometimes get the error 'Folder not empty' when trying to delete a folder using 'Telnet' with some operating systems, under the programme when viewing in the Media - Video view are the time (24 hour format), the date (for UK, day:month, no year), the duration, the channel number and the channel name, this information is stored in one of the support files and can be viewed by clicking on the recording when you 'Browse' '/ media /My Video'
 
I cannot imagine why that might be, and therefore am unwilling to believe it without hard evidence (as opposed to anecdote).
A bit difficult to provide evidence for this scenario, however it is similar to when the Humax is in read only mode were all recordings appear to record, eg red ring is lit, or a red dot appears next to the relevant EPG entry

If you prefer to have evidence, create a small text file and upload it to your own Humax, remember to remove the '.txt' extension, the filename needs to reflect the programme series you intend to attempt to record, avoid series with 'New:' as this is renamed to 'New_' by the Humax Fox

Having done what I describe, I have just checked and, 'The Chase' has successfully been recorded and saved in its correct folder, I have also successfully opened the recording while it is still being recorded

I would welcome how such hard evidence can be obtained, I will be more than willing to share it
 

MikeSh

Well-Known Member
How is this a help? How can it be applied after an event, even if it's real?
Obviously it isn't going to go back in time and recover what's lost, but at least you can correct the problem for future recordings.

I would welcome how such hard evidence can be obtained, I will be more than willing to share it
You've done a pretty thorough job I think. It would be good to know what causes the situation in the first place, but that's a tough one - it's obviously not a common occurrence.
 
It would be good to know what causes the situation in the first place, but that's a tough one - it's obviously not a common occurrence
That's the reason I reported my findings, I am aware of a system-wide read-only state when nothing is recorded, but only having one scheduled recording not saving was a major head scratcher, I tried a 'fixdisk', doing a new channel retune, freed up a little disk space in case it was a hard disk issue, tried the ITV+1 option, then came across the directory listing using 'Solar-PuTTY' which showed folders in blue and non-folders in white, I knew that as 'The Chase' was showing as white, the system would not be able to create a folder, 'The Chase_ Celebrity Special' was showing as blue, the '_' in the filename has replaced the ':' by the system when the folder was created and 'The Chase' should have directly above showing in blue not white
Hope this info is of help to anyone else who experiences a similar rare situation
 

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
I would welcome how such hard evidence can be obtained
I have had to re-read this thread several times to understand what you are driving at:

Your assertion is that a file erroneously present in the file system with the same path and name as the folder the Humax firmware is attempting to create, causes the folder creation to fail, the recording to fail, and yet give all the outward appearance of a recording in progress.

It seems unlikely (given our experience with the Humax code development) the engineers would have anticipated such a thing and coded for it.

It seems unlikely the WebIF status would have shown an active recording in progress, because that relies on observing data traffic (and there was none).

create a small text file and upload it to your own Humax, remember to remove the '.txt' extension, the filename needs to reflect the programme series you intend to attempt to record,
OK, I'll have a play and report back. To create a dummy file 'xxx' all you have to do is touch xxx, no need to upload and rename empty files.

I have to say that, although I have experienced failed recordings, I have never (to my recollection) had circumstances which correspond with this. My previous bad experiences were with Accurate Recording not tracking properly. I am curious how your circumstances could have come about – how did this erroneous file get there? Could it have been user misadventure?

avoid series with 'New:' as this is renamed to 'New_' by the Humax Fox
All characters in a programme title which would be illegal in a Linux file name are substituted by "_" when creating the folder for a series and/or the .ts, .htm, .nts, or .thm file – that is entirely predictable, is not a "renaming" process, and there is no need to avoid. It's just that the dummy file would need to be touch "New_ xxx". (Speech marks, or quotes, are needed if the string contains spaces, so that the spaces are not taken as separators. Alternatively prefix each space by the 'escape' character "\", eg touch New_\ xxx.)

BTW: There are several Humax Foxes. We're talking about the HDR-FOX. Consistent nomenclature avoids potential confusion – Glossary (click).

if you do a one-off recording of a series programme, it will appear in the root directory, because a one-off recording of a series is no longer a series recording schedule, it is a one-off, but though it shows just the file name, this is the descriptor name, the actual filename actually includes the date and time of the recording
Yes, of course we know all this – but we don't call it the "descriptor name", we call it the media list title. The programme listings you get when you press the Media button are taken from the actual title of the programme, as stored within the .htm sidecar file. This side-steps the problem of illegal characters in programme titles. Have a look at the rename option on the WebIF media browser OPT+ button, and/or acquaint yourself with the command line hmt utility.

(I have newk installed 'Automatically kill series name prefixes like 'New:'')
It is all the irrelevant asides like this which made it so hard to pick the bones out of your posts.

'New_ The Chase_20200207_1655.ts', 'New_ The Chase' the file name, '20200207' the date as Year Month Day, and 1655 the time, '.ts' the file extension, there are two additional files, '.nts' and '.hmt' a forth file is created once a file has been viewed '.thm'
FOURTH! Forth: as in go forth and multiply; a river in Scotland; a computer programming language.

.hmt holds metadata (Humax MeTadata?) for the recording: such as whether it is protected, decrypted, HiDef, unplayed, resume point, where the user bookmarks are...

.nts holds indexing information (iNdex TS?) used to quickly locate frames for trick play (FF/REW etc).

.thm is the THuMbnail image displayed in the media list, generated the first time the recording is played or during shut-down housekeeping (for any recordings without thumbnails), or by CF intervention.

For completeness: .hmi (Humax Metadata Import?) is a special sidecar file used to store the resume point for non-TS media files (ie imported MP4 files or whatever).

You need to get with the pace. All the above can be found on the forum / wiki (but a google search will be needed for three-character search terms) – Newbies' Guide to the Forum (click).
 
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Luke

Well-Knwοn Мember
Your assertion is that a file erroneously present in the file system with the same path and name as the folder the Humax firmware is attempting to create, causes the folder creation to fail, the recording to fail, and yet give all the outward appearance of a recording in progress.

It seems unlikely (given our experience with the Humax code development) the engineers would have anticipated such a thing and coded for it.
Either they did or the O/S takes care of it, and some of us have already seen the consequence. The Humax adds "(1)" to the file names.

if you do a one-off recording of a series programme, it will appear in the root directory, because a one-off recording of a series is no longer a series recording schedule, it is a one-off, but though it shows just the file name, this is the descriptor name, the actual filename actually includes the date and time of the recording
It also includes "(1)" if the filename already exists

Recording both SD and HD usually produces a potential clash of file names, but at least from version 2.01.20 and probably earlier, all versions cope with this by the addition of "(1)" to the filename for one of the recordings.
1581245381701.png
 
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Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
They did and some of us have already seen what the consequence. The Humax adds "(1)" to the file names.
Interesting, but I think that might be standard Linux as opposed to Humax code! The only requirement is that the file names are unique - access is via the media list, and the title presented in the media list is stored in the .hmt...
 

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
Either they did or the O/S takes care of it, and some of us have already seen the consequence. The Humax adds "(1)" to the file names.
Actually, on second thoughts, no. You've demonstrated what happens when there is a file creation name conflict, not what happens when there is a folder creation name conflict.
 

Black Hole

May contain traces of nut
The only thing I had to go on is that Windows does (the user interface offers a suffixed name if it thinks you might accidentally overwrite an existing file... or at least enough apps do that I assume it is an OS function).
 
for those who have missed previous posts of mine, I have a couple of Humax HDR Fox T2, one with a 1Tb hard drive, the other has a 500Gb hard drive

lots a talk, debate, info exchange, picking at a minor spelling infraction, but thank you for explaining the thumbnail file

how the issue happened, the explanation as to how it occurred, may never be known, I merely documented it as a help to others

I use the Humax, oh very sorry the Humax HDR Fox T2, with a 1Tb hard drive, which is fitted with a moulded 13amp 230v AC plug, don't forget the APC ES700 UPS it is plugged in to, and no, the UPS monitoring plug-in or lead is not configured, to record programmes I'm interested in watching, after all it's just telly

may I ask that before anyone says 'I don't believe it', they first try to recreate my findings

create a file 'touch NCIS' within the 'My Video' directory with an up and coming programme name, there are episodes of NCIS starting at 2pm on channel 39 'CBS Justice', time of writing it is sunday 9th february 2020, I've just created an empty file using 'touch NCIS' using 'Solar-PuTTY'

it's now 11.40am and going to run 'fixdisk' to make sure there are no pending disk issues
 
Checking partition /dev/sda3 now completed

Checking partition /dev/sda1 now completed

now Checking partition /dev/sda2
 
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