MikeSh
Well-Known Member
OK.
So is only half(ish) of the country on second generation now? eg. It's a geographical rollout.
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Smart meters, less smart companies
- Thread starter Ex Libris
- Start date
So is only half(ish) of the country on second generation now? eg. It's a geographical rollout.
I think this rather proves that it is difficult to get reliable information about smart meters, even here where many members have a technical background. I’ve had automated responses from Ofgem, SSE, and Bulb. The message I’m getting from the latter two is, sadly, they don’t really want to talk to anyone who is not senile.
I believe MikeSh is correct about there being at least two regional variations (longer signal paths in Scotland?). I can’t confirm that a final meter reading might be necessary before a death certificate can be issued, while the dying or recently deceased are required to pay for their own life support or refrigeration (yet). I did find one report that a 5 foot old lady had been provided with a meter on a 9 foot pole, which suggests that this thing has not been properly thought out. Forewarned, she could have furnished herself with a 10 foot pole. While I hesitate to contradict Black Hole, I’m afraid I may have got it the right way round, and the second generation meters use a technology which conveniently few people will be in a position to test in advance.
The idea of a meter that doesn’t need human reading is superficially attractive, but I do object to the presentation. The greatest thing since cotton wool is clearly real bread – sliced.
I believe MikeSh is correct about there being at least two regional variations (longer signal paths in Scotland?). I can’t confirm that a final meter reading might be necessary before a death certificate can be issued, while the dying or recently deceased are required to pay for their own life support or refrigeration (yet). I did find one report that a 5 foot old lady had been provided with a meter on a 9 foot pole, which suggests that this thing has not been properly thought out. Forewarned, she could have furnished herself with a 10 foot pole. While I hesitate to contradict Black Hole, I’m afraid I may have got it the right way round, and the second generation meters use a technology which conveniently few people will be in a position to test in advance.
The idea of a meter that doesn’t need human reading is superficially attractive, but I do object to the presentation. The greatest thing since cotton wool is clearly real bread – sliced.
Jacquart Mosaïque. Better be quick, it's on sale in Tesco..
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
I got it the wrong way around:
https://www.uswitch.com/gas-electricity/guides/smart-meters-explained/ said:
On the other hand, these could both describe second generation, because I have yet to confirm DCC is not carried over the existing cellphone network.
everthewatcher
Forum Supporter
Yes and no. According to the Smart Meters website:
Why are there different WAN communication protocols North and South?
DCC went out to tender to find CSPs (Communication Service Providers) to provide the WAN (Wide Area Network) for three regions: North, Central and South.
The winners of this commercial process offered different technologies reflecting the different population density and terrain in the regions :
Arqiva Limited for CSP North region with a 15-year contract worth £625M using Long-Range Radio communications.
Telefónica for the CSP Centre (Midlands, East Anglia and Wales) and South (south of England) regions using the 2G/3G cellular radio communications network.
The two Telefonica contracts over 15 years are worth £1500M.
Read more at: https://www.smartme.co.uk/how-they-work.html
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The latest update seems to be October 2019.
-Most of the people who are happy are putting the equivalent of shillings in the meter. They would be. I remember writing out cheques for bags of 5p pieces.
-“Some smart meters over record the power used by up to 250% and some under record by 40 % depending on the power measurement technique used. Further work will have to be carried out in this area.” Not on my watch.
-“Like any technical secure system today ...the weakest link is probably the staff involved along the way”. Hmm...
-“Most suppliers seem to have decided it is too dangerous to remotely disconnect or reconnect”.
“Most suppliers?” I would really want to see an outright ban, given the number of fly-by-nights.
-“Overall the whole of DCC is facilitated by Capita plc.”
Ah yes. The wonderful people who took three months to pay out my pension.
-South (south of England) regions using the 2G/3G cellular radio communications network…
To quote Black Hole’s Law: Anything that can go wrong, will...
-Most of the people who are happy are putting the equivalent of shillings in the meter. They would be. I remember writing out cheques for bags of 5p pieces.
-“Some smart meters over record the power used by up to 250% and some under record by 40 % depending on the power measurement technique used. Further work will have to be carried out in this area.” Not on my watch.
-“Like any technical secure system today ...the weakest link is probably the staff involved along the way”. Hmm...
-“Most suppliers seem to have decided it is too dangerous to remotely disconnect or reconnect”.
“Most suppliers?” I would really want to see an outright ban, given the number of fly-by-nights.
-“Overall the whole of DCC is facilitated by Capita plc.”
Ah yes. The wonderful people who took three months to pay out my pension.
-South (south of England) regions using the 2G/3G cellular radio communications network…
To quote Black Hole’s Law: Anything that can go wrong, will...
D
Deleted member 473
And you couldn't make it up!
A long time ago, didn't Sky require your box to be permanently connected to a landline? Think old technology.
A long time ago, didn't Sky require your box to be permanently connected to a landline? Think old technology.
But if you plugged it into a phone socket wired to a 9v battery you could get free movies as long as you never plugged it into the real landline socket again afterwards.
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
I suppose that makes sense, considering the phone not-spots that need to be covered, but they're throwing an awful lot of money at it... I wonder how much it costs to keep meter readers employed?
A company I worked for was involved with the integrated communications system for emergency services, and integrated regional control rooms. That turned out a dog's breakfast too.
I do have a letter which refers to a radio network being phased out, without specifying Radio 4 Long Wave. I am having a problem with my Epson scanner at the moment. This may be resolved by upgrading to Groovy Gorilla (sic.), which I hesitate to do because of issues on the old desktop. It appears that not everyone is as careful as I am.
The report about an old lady getting a new meter she would have difficulty reading if it wasn’t actually operating in smart mode seemed not entirely incredible.
My suggestion that people might have to languish between life and death because the meter readers were being kept indoors may have been incautious. It is probably even now being pasted into letters to go out to customers.
The phrase “in all fairness” sticks in the throat sometimes, but firms should not have to risk their reputation because of an ill thought out target, and a well founded belief on the part of customers that something is not quite right. +250%/-40% doesn’t sound like a acceptable level of tolerance in this context.
I see the Torygraph has picked up on this (6 December). It quotes an Ofgem report that of 16 253 003 meters, 3 697 390 are not operating in smart mode.
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me too
everthewatcher
Forum Supporter
Tetra?
Excellent. I do hope all other members will choose NOT to have a meter installed as all these installations are costing ALL of us quite a lot of monay
Do not underestimate the power of exponential.
everthewatcher
Forum Supporter
Not clear what you're quoting but that looks to me like a bit of confusion over real and apparent power.
One of the main criticisms of smart meters is that, among other things, they can be remotely set to measure real or apparent power. Real power is what traditional meters measure but modern electronics don't behave like resistive loads and can have power factors way off unity as the current leads the voltage. So switching to apparent power where the phase relationship between voltage and current is ignored means higher bills.
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
We should only be paying for real power.
everthewatcher
Forum Supporter
Traditionally domestic customers have been, with large industrial customers being charged for apparent power (VA). But the ability to switch between real and apparent power wouldn't be built into domestic smart meters if there were no plans to use it. [Edit] And even if there were no plans, if it's there it'll be used.