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I do know about driving automatic cars and don't need a bloody Janet and John explanation. But your references emphasise my point. The last two references indicate to use the right foot to brake, exactly as in a real car. (the first one doesn't mention this). If you miss the brake and stamp on the accelerator in a real car in an emergency, your left foot 'automatically' dips the clutch removing the drive. In an auto........... crash with max power to the wheels.
 
Or the position of your foot? On the brake my foot is pointing in line with my leg but on the throttle is pointing a little off to one o'clock. That said my right foot is wonky anyway and splays out naturally if I stand with kneecaps straight.
 
Mike0001 said:
But the feel of the pedals is or should be totally different.
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When the accelerator pedal is pressed to the floor, I suspect it feels pretty much like the brake pedal even if a bit further down. If you think you have your foot on the brake pedal, you will just press it harder in your attempt to stop. It happens!
 
Of course, if you are using progressive braking then you soon find out if your foot is on the wrong pedal before it becomes a drama.
 
I'm talking an emergency stop, when your mind is a bit distracted by what you are about to hit.
 
I used to own an MGC GT with a Borg-Warner 3 speed auto box. This combined with a manual choke made for some hairy moments in early morning town traffic but it enabled me to develop nifty feet coordination.
Honest John has always advocated left foot braking in an auto, but I found it unnatural, preferring to lift off the gas and brake.
 
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Mike0001 said:
But the feel of the pedals is or should be totally different. Maybe it is down to poor design in some cars.
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There is no standard feel - different manufacturers have their own approaches, which has the effect of keeping a Ford driver in Fords (etc).

For example: a Ford accelerator has relatively little resistance in it and is largely governed by position. Meanwhile a Vauxhall accelerator has a lot of resistance and is largely governed by pressure. Brakes are a different matter - they mostly have the same system of master/slave hydraulic cylinders behind them, but are tuned by the hydraulic ratios, the type of calipers, the vacuum assist, and just the size of the discs makes a huge difference.

Rally drivers (having the ultimate in handling skills) use their left foot on the clutch and right foot on the accelerator - then use either on the brake according to what they need to do. Using the brake while still hard on the accelerator is not unusual. Right-foot brakers use "heel & toe" (which isn't really heel and toe). Rally skills come in handy in emergency situations such as skidding, but less so now cars have ABS and ESP as standard.

The more different cars you drive, preferably over a short space of time, the more adaptable you become the the differences in feel etc... and accommodating to the idea of left foot braking. Only driving one car for years (which is, let's face it, the norm) fixes ones habits.
 
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Black Hole said:
The more different cars you drive, preferably over a short space of time, the more adaptable you become the the differences in feel etc... and accommodating to the idea of left foot braking. Only driving one car for years (which is, let's face it, the norm) fixes ones habits.
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That seems to be the nub of honest John's article. They (he?) says: That's why I recommend elderly drivers to to think very carefully before making a switch from a lifetime of manuals to an automatic. And the article mostly seems to be about the dangers of old people having accidents.
I'd certainly agree autos have more danger of uncontrolled runaway, and in more ways than that discussed here, but for those who drive both types there are also risks in left foot braking due to 'muscle memory'. It's simpler, and that usually means safer, to use the same control interactions in both types of car - stamping on a non-existent clutch pedal isn't going to be a problem :)
 
We've had "Fake news" (a term I hate! :mad:), and the dodgy science in the press, now we have "Fake Research" http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-39357819
I'm not surprised. There has always been pressure on universities, academic staff and researchers to publish more papers, and get new research grants - even if the research doesn't justify it. Even in my day, the pressure was there to publish a positive result - even when the method doesn't work. It should be a valid response to say this doesn't work. It just doesn't get you another research grant. I've certainly seen plagiarism of my work and that of other colleagues. Peer review of papers should catch some of this. (I remember rejecting a paper sent to me for review that was a straight "lift" from another author's chapter in a book).
 
MikeSh said:
stamping on a non-existent clutch pedal isn't going to be a problem :)
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Accshully, the "non-existent clutch pedal" exists in the form of an extra-wide brake pedal. That's how one ends up standing the car on its nose and giving those behind one hell of a fright. It is necessary to adapt to an automatic or a manual when swapping, and I do it infrequently enough that learning to left-foot brake has too little pay-off - all I do is suppress the clutch foot (and have a couple of sudden stops until I get into it). Nonetheless, it has to be sensible to be able to control the forward (or reverse) motion at the same time as using the accelerator; even if you perceive the advantage as slight, it is still better.
 
We have an automatic and manual and have no problem driving either consistently, ie, left foot clutch, right foot brakes and accelerator. Until about 2000 we had never driven automatics, but in the US found them so relaxing we replaced our one manual car with an auto, and always hired autos on holiday, as one thing to make lefthand drive less stressful.

Hiring an auto in Europe is now expensive, so we are back to manuals again. My illness means we have not been to the US for 12 years, travel insurance being prohibitively expensive. 12 years ago, we were quoted £1000 a day, but the holiday was already booked before my diagnosis, so we went ahead without travel insurance.
 
Wentworth Woodhouse to be refurbished after £7m sale agreed
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The house was put up for sale in May 2015 following the death of owner Clifford Newbold
​
A stately home which claims to be the "largest privately-owned house in Europe" will be refurbished following a £7m sale to a charity.

Grade-1 listed Wentworth Woodhouse has been sold to the Wentworth Woodhouse Preservation Trust (WWPT).

The sale of the mansion and gardens was funded by grants, including £3.5m from the National Heritage Memorial Fund.

The trust said "complex" negotiations to buy the property, near Rotherham, had taken more than a year.

WWPT said it planned to spend around £42m restoring the property and associated land.

The government has given £7.6m towards the renovation, with the trust planning to raise the rest through grants and a public appeal.

The staterooms and gardens will be open to the public, with the ancillary parts of the building and grounds converted into a business centre and events space.

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The staterooms in the main house will be open to the public
​
The chair of WWPT, Julie Kenny, said: "This is the culmination of five years very hard work and has been made possible by the support of many different charities, government bodies and individuals, including the Chancellor of the Exchequer.

"It is great news for the people of Rotherham and for everyone who cares about historic buildings."

Built by the Marquesses of Rockingham between 1725 and 1750, the front of the house is more than 600 feet (180m) long.

The main house has more than 200 rooms, with a run of state rooms behind the east front centring on the spectacular, double-height Marble Salon - considered to be one of the finest early 18th-century interiors in England.

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The house was put up for sale in 2015 following the death of its owner
It was bought in 1999 by architect Clifford Newbold, whose family sold it after he died in April 2015

A previous £8m deal to sell it to a Hong Kong-based investment company fell through in November 2015.
 
Black Hole said:
... an extra-wide brake pedal.
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Wow. I can remember those, but can't remember when. Nothing I've had in the last, say, 20 years has had other than 'normal' size brake and throttle with (usually) a rest for the left foot. I suspect they faded away with the general adoption of power brakes - I think the large size was so you could use both feet.
 
Black Hole said:
That is definitely one of the more impressive properties in this country!
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Wentworth was a trusted advisor to Charles I, but Charles cut him loose, to be hung, to try to save his own neck. As we all know, that didn't work.

I have been reading Ackworth's history of the civil war. The Stuarts lived up to the poor precedent of their ancestors!

James I, son of Mary queen of Scots, bisexual pedophile.

Charles I, who precipitated the civil war by almost immediately launching an expedition against Scotland.

Charles II, playboy king with no legitimate issue.

His brother James, who fled the country.
 
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Sticking with expensive buildings ... Skyscraper suspended from an asteroid.
April fool or publicity for out of work architect?
 
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