Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
I'm sure somebody here would be happy to buy it from you.
Regarding analogue to HDMI, there is a racket of selling cables with the relevant connectors which IMO have no chance of working at all. See HERE (click).
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Green screen
- Thread starter tobyjuggler
- Start date
I'm sure somebody here would be happy to buy it from you.
Regarding analogue to HDMI, there is a racket of selling cables with the relevant connectors which IMO have no chance of working at all. See HERE (click).
Captain Clegg
Member
Thanks, so the scart is worse but using cables is worse even than that?
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
I don't understand where you are coming from.
HDMI is a serial digital point-to-point interface (ie one machine's output goes to another machine's input and nowhere else), and sends 24-bit colour information for every addressable point in the image - as such the picture received and displayed is exactly what was sent.
RCA is the name of a coaxial connector rather than a comms system, also known as "phono". Sometimes there are five connectors in the set for RGB video + LR audio, but if there are just three that's composite video (yellow connector) + LR audio (red and white connectors). RGB is better quality than composite, and can accommodate various scan resolutions much the same as a computer VGA interface to the monitor. However, these are still analogue signals (with sync signals carried on the green channel).
Composite uses an encoding scheme to add colour information to a luminance signal (effectively the black & white picture). If you were to view the composite video without extracting the colour signal, it would be monochrome. The method used to "hide" the colour signal inside the luminance signal is what distinguishes PAL from NTSC, and these rely on a high frequency sub-carrier that has little or no effect on a monochrome display. As such, the bandwidth of the luminance signal is restricted to substantially less than the chrominance sub-carrier, and a composite video connection only carries video at a resolution equivalent to "old-fashioned" 625-line analogue broadcast TV.
The Humax HDR-FOX and HD-FOX have composite video RCA connectors (plus left and right audio).
The SCART socket is another matter (AKA Peritel). This is again a point-to-point interface, but has 21 pins to play with. Connections are available for input and output (simultaneously) of LR audio, composite video, and RGB/YCbCr video. YCbCr is an alternative method of encoding the colour of each pixel more akin to the composite system (Y is the luminance and Cb, Cr are the two colour difference signals). Each is as good as the other, and often selectable by option on the equipment sending the video.
Display equipment (the TV) will just take the composite signal if that is all it is able to do, but if possible it is better to switch it to the RGB/YCbCr signal set. Because these send video over three separate connections without sub-carriers, they are capable of much higher quality and higher resolutions.
Thus, whether SCART is better than RCA depends on what facilities are available and how you use them. For modern TV and video equipment, the best choice is HDMI every time. If I had to, my next choice would be component video on RCA connections (five of them, not three!), and then RGB over SCART. Only after that would I consider composite RCA (three connections) or composite SCART.
My comments regarding cables with an HDMI plug on one end and analogue connectors on the other is simply that just making and selling such a cable to the general public is tantamount to fraud - these cables have no purpose, even though Joe Bloggs might think they do because they exist. Connecting an HDMI input or output to analogue outputs or inputs won't work, and in the worst case could cause damage.
HDMI is a serial digital point-to-point interface (ie one machine's output goes to another machine's input and nowhere else), and sends 24-bit colour information for every addressable point in the image - as such the picture received and displayed is exactly what was sent.
RCA is the name of a coaxial connector rather than a comms system, also known as "phono". Sometimes there are five connectors in the set for RGB video + LR audio, but if there are just three that's composite video (yellow connector) + LR audio (red and white connectors). RGB is better quality than composite, and can accommodate various scan resolutions much the same as a computer VGA interface to the monitor. However, these are still analogue signals (with sync signals carried on the green channel).
Composite uses an encoding scheme to add colour information to a luminance signal (effectively the black & white picture). If you were to view the composite video without extracting the colour signal, it would be monochrome. The method used to "hide" the colour signal inside the luminance signal is what distinguishes PAL from NTSC, and these rely on a high frequency sub-carrier that has little or no effect on a monochrome display. As such, the bandwidth of the luminance signal is restricted to substantially less than the chrominance sub-carrier, and a composite video connection only carries video at a resolution equivalent to "old-fashioned" 625-line analogue broadcast TV.
The Humax HDR-FOX and HD-FOX have composite video RCA connectors (plus left and right audio).
The SCART socket is another matter (AKA Peritel). This is again a point-to-point interface, but has 21 pins to play with. Connections are available for input and output (simultaneously) of LR audio, composite video, and RGB/YCbCr video. YCbCr is an alternative method of encoding the colour of each pixel more akin to the composite system (Y is the luminance and Cb, Cr are the two colour difference signals). Each is as good as the other, and often selectable by option on the equipment sending the video.
Display equipment (the TV) will just take the composite signal if that is all it is able to do, but if possible it is better to switch it to the RGB/YCbCr signal set. Because these send video over three separate connections without sub-carriers, they are capable of much higher quality and higher resolutions.
Thus, whether SCART is better than RCA depends on what facilities are available and how you use them. For modern TV and video equipment, the best choice is HDMI every time. If I had to, my next choice would be component video on RCA connections (five of them, not three!), and then RGB over SCART. Only after that would I consider composite RCA (three connections) or composite SCART.
My comments regarding cables with an HDMI plug on one end and analogue connectors on the other is simply that just making and selling such a cable to the general public is tantamount to fraud - these cables have no purpose, even though Joe Bloggs might think they do because they exist. Connecting an HDMI input or output to analogue outputs or inputs won't work, and in the worst case could cause damage.
Captain Clegg
Member
You mean someone would actually BUY it, even with the problem?
Captain Clegg
Member
Something like these
I know quality would be compromised, but by how much?
All I want is a simple option to the problem that doesn't seem to want to go away without me chucking the hummy out!
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
You read my post before it was finished. Have another look. I did say it was a work in progress.
It's probably only a problem for you and your particular TV, not a problem in general. I don't have any difficulty with HDMI sync on my LG or Samsung TVs, or with my HDMI matrix switch. Have you tried adding a switch, or are you just not inclined to and would rather scrap the Hummy???
Captain Clegg
Member
Yes, probably, but very frustrating nonetheless when it seemed to be going so well for about 30 months.
So, are there any televisions that are worse than others?-mine's a Samsung
So, are there any televisions that are worse than others?-mine's a Samsung
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
Ah, I had missed (or forgotten) that point. In which case I would try testing it on other TVs - any friends you can impose on? If it really is a hard fault out of warranty (could be), Humax do reasonable terms for replacement. Otherwise use SCART and set the TV and Humax to RGB (the SCART cable needs to be fully-wired and not a thin cheapo).
Captain Clegg
Member
I just seemed to recall that certain televisions were a potential problem, I might give the scart another go.
I have tried it on a technica tv with the same results.
I have tried it on a technica tv with the same results.
Captain Clegg
Member
I feel that I would be wasting money as I have no confidence in it anymore, switches are not cheap and may not work, however, which are you using and is it cheap enough to give it a go?
Captain Clegg
Member
Ok, I have now tried it with a scart connection and it works, no green screen issue, if anyone else is reading this, no switches or expensive items needed.
Thanks for all the tips and pointers everyone, this is the simplest way round the problem.
I spoke to someone at Humax yesterday and it seems there is no solution to the problem as it can't be pinpointed.
Thanks for all the tips and pointers everyone, this is the simplest way round the problem.
I spoke to someone at Humax yesterday and it seems there is no solution to the problem as it can't be pinpointed.
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
You're right, nothing more expensive than a decent SCART cable is required for that work-around, but I doubt many people would be satisfied with an analogue connection (although I know of one who was happy running a 50" screen via 10m of composite).
Captain Clegg
Member
Well, it works and the picture is fine, so I'm sticking with it.
MartinOnline
Member
I have my HD Fox-T2 (digibox version of the HDR) connected to a Technika TV via the built-in HDMI switch in my TVonics PVR HD500. The TVonics has to be powered up for the switch to work, so it can be considered a type of active switch.
I have had no problems viewing the HD Fox on the Technika but, very occasionally (say 5 times in 18 months), when I switch back to the Tvonics from the HD Fox I get a green picture screen. Then I have to force a new HDMI negotiation by changing the output resolution from the Tvonics away from its Auto setting. The picture, then, returns correctly and I reset the TVonics back to Auto.
Although the SCART output is good with TV upscaling, the HDMI output is often better.
I can't seem to see your answer to Black Hole's question about cycling the HDMI resolution using the V-Format button (bottom row on the Remote). [That's effectively what I do with my TVonics.]
Did you try it?
You can "fix" the HDR's output resolution using that button and see if the situation changes.
Finally, if your picture breaks up on HDMI but not on SCART (possibly eliminating an incoming signal problems) then you may have a faulty box. However, the break-up may be an artifact of your HDMI problem with the TV not coping with the HDR's HDMI output. Hence changing and fixing the output resolution will help to clarify the situation.
Martin
I have had no problems viewing the HD Fox on the Technika but, very occasionally (say 5 times in 18 months), when I switch back to the Tvonics from the HD Fox I get a green picture screen. Then I have to force a new HDMI negotiation by changing the output resolution from the Tvonics away from its Auto setting. The picture, then, returns correctly and I reset the TVonics back to Auto.
Although the SCART output is good with TV upscaling, the HDMI output is often better.
I can't seem to see your answer to Black Hole's question about cycling the HDMI resolution using the V-Format button (bottom row on the Remote). [That's effectively what I do with my TVonics.]
Did you try it?
You can "fix" the HDR's output resolution using that button and see if the situation changes.
Finally, if your picture breaks up on HDMI but not on SCART (possibly eliminating an incoming signal problems) then you may have a faulty box. However, the break-up may be an artifact of your HDMI problem with the TV not coping with the HDR's HDMI output. Hence changing and fixing the output resolution will help to clarify the situation.
Martin
Captain Clegg
Member
I did and it didn't make any difference. I have been watching using the scart cable and at least we can make use of the box, the picture is good so I think that will do us for the time being.
I appreciate that the scart output is not as good as the HDMI, but considering the HDMI output causes problems I would actually say that the scart output was better and more stable in this instance.
Thanks
Black Hole
May contain traces of nut
The source of the HDMI cable is irrelevant (as long as the cable is a known working one).
BMAX
Active Member
I too have recently developed this problem. After faultless operation for more than two years, the HDR occasionally began to fail to handshake with the TV, resulting in a green screen. I found by trial and error that switching just the TV off and on again fixed this problem. However, over the last few weeks, 'occasionally' gradually became 'regularly', and finally became 'always'. This was still fixable by switching the TV off for a few seconds, but gradually even this stopped reliably working, requiring several switching cycles before lock was obtained. This behaviour appears to to me to be a timing problem that is slowly getting worse. Sometimes, I have given up and watched via the TV's SD tuner.
Before anyone asks, none of the suggested workrounds work, cycling the V-format or changing the TV settings achieve nothing, the order of switching on the PVR and TV makes no difference and several different HDMI leads have been tried. I have my PVR and Sony Bravia TV controlled by a Harmony 200 remote, both being switched on by a single key press, but , as mentioned above, individual switching with the original remotes produces the same problem.
As I am running custom software 2.19, and as this is the only thing that may have changed recently, my next step will be to remove this completely and do a clean reinstall of official version 1.02.32 to see if this makes any difference.
Before anyone asks, none of the suggested workrounds work, cycling the V-format or changing the TV settings achieve nothing, the order of switching on the PVR and TV makes no difference and several different HDMI leads have been tried. I have my PVR and Sony Bravia TV controlled by a Harmony 200 remote, both being switched on by a single key press, but , as mentioned above, individual switching with the original remotes produces the same problem.
As I am running custom software 2.19, and as this is the only thing that may have changed recently, my next step will be to remove this completely and do a clean reinstall of official version 1.02.32 to see if this makes any difference.
ChrisDaniels
Well-Known Member
Try a factory reset. It won't delete any recordings but will wipe your schedules.
Would be interested to see if it makes a difference.
Would be interested to see if it makes a difference.